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-   -   Raf99 : 1993 Accord EX (http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=139375)

NH-503P-3 10-07-2018 12:43 AM

I had to pull my tranny a while back for a quick fix. It sucks. I feel for ya bro. I wonder if our clocks can work as a volt meter or be custom built into one kinda like your setup. It looks great.

Raf99 10-07-2018 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NH-503P-3 (Post 3285726)
I had to pull my tranny a while back for a quick fix. It sucks. I feel for ya bro. I wonder if our clocks can work as a volt meter or be custom built into one kinda like your setup. It looks great.

Yeeep. I did pull the tranny and it sucked. Really sucked. Almost easier to pull the engine. I really should have tried lowering the engine more on an angle, but I was already pushing it. Axles had to come out, traction bar had to be taken apart. VSS sensor, mounts, intake piping, etc. Getting it back in was a battle! There was a lot of sweat and cursing involved!!

http://clevercomputersolutions.ca/cb...004_205327.jpg

I was amazed how quick I can tear a trans apart and put back together now.
http://clevercomputersolutions.ca/cb...930_194207.jpg

The soup like mess that was created by using the wrong sealant. All cleaned up and used the good grey shit.
http://clevercomputersolutions.ca/cb...930_194225.jpg

A aluminum washer I found on the garage floor under the front of the car. I have no idea where this came from or where it goes. I have never seen this before in my life. I doesn't seem to match any diameter of anything on the whole engine/trans. Meh....
http://clevercomputersolutions.ca/cb...006_141138.jpg

She's back up and running.
http://clevercomputersolutions.ca/cb...006_171442.jpg

Grill is the last to go on as she idled.
http://clevercomputersolutions.ca/cb...006_171433.jpg\

I also found out the clutch has no break in period :) I also adjusted the clutch so the engagement point is near the floor more. Went for a drive around the block. Squealed the tires accidentally trying to leave the stop sign haha. Going to take it easy on the clutch and trans for a while. The twin disc is louder now that she's broken in a bit. But I definitely want to try a 2nd gear burn out :) hehe.... I'm also looking for some ideas on how to make he car look meaner.

CyborgGT 10-07-2018 07:24 PM

Looks like the oil pan crush washer.

Raf99 10-08-2018 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CyborgGT (Post 3285743)
Looks like the oil pan crush washer.

Good catch, but no. I checked and it is not that. I'm not sure where this came from. But took Sally for a 3 hour drive today and no issues. So...not sure.

LOL. Wanted to see how the new clutch responds to a burn out compared to the old clutch. haha hahahah haha... Oh my. I was a like a giddy school kid. First gear felt like I was on ice. No issues at all. Before I knew it I could see LSD black marks in the mirror and all one could hear was BOV from hitting red line and letting off the gas. After that it was just playing around with the throttle to make them spin less or more. That truly made my day :)

G. Wiffington 10-12-2018 05:28 PM

This build is so badass!!!!

The voltage meter you made is soooo goooood!!!!!!
I want that so bad in my CB.

I was thinking maybe that washer looks like the one for fill bolt on the trans?

Grumpys93 10-12-2018 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raf99 (Post 3285755)
Good catch, but no. I checked and it is not that. I'm not sure where this came from. But took Sally for a 3 hour drive today and no issues. So...not sure.

LOL. Wanted to see how the new clutch responds to a burn out compared to the old clutch. haha hahahah haha... Oh my. I was a like a giddy school kid. First gear felt like I was on ice. No issues at all. Before I knew it I could see LSD black marks in the mirror and all one could hear was BOV from hitting red line and letting off the gas. After that it was just playing around with the throttle to make them spin less or more. That truly made my day :)

And you didnít record it to share with us.....

Raf99 10-15-2018 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grumpys93 (Post 3285836)
And you didnít record it to share with us.....

True. Hard when you drive alone. I'll try to get something for ya.

So another issue has risen. I blow my 180amp in-line breaker to the ALT when I use my heater fan (on high), with the lights on, stereo on, everything on.

The setup is battery in trunk. 2AWG to engine bay (w/ 180amp breaker)
Splits to two 4AWG (in engine bay)
1 x 4AWG -> starter
1 x 4AWG -> ALT & fuse box (but the alt has a 180amp breaker right after the split because it's a gauge drop and because that wire goes under the car and could be damaged.

Seems correct. Never had any issues. ..... until I turned the heat on the other day and she almost left me stranded. Glad I installed the volt meter in the dash. I looked over and it said 9V ... I turned shit off (stereo, lights, etc. and then it said 10V. The car will act weird after that as you are limiting volts to the ECU or having "brown outs". Dash dims, etc. Gauges go weird.
I turned the heat off, flicked the circuit breaker switch and started it. It barely started and came back to life. Still, not cool!

Now I'm left in a situation where I don't know a lot of people who I can "run this by" and determine the correction. The car guys I know don't get this technical. Also, there's no going back to the old setup, that was years ago.

So I've been thinking about it for days and I always trust the gauge chart. I'm going to replace the 180amp breaker for the ALT (in engine bay) with a 200amp. Yes the wire can handle it. But before I do there is one pending question which I do not know..
How is a 130amp output ALT blowing a 180amp in-line circuit breaker? and/or ... is the blower motor pulling more amps than needed due to old age..

CyborgGT 10-15-2018 10:11 PM

Do you have a ground running from the battery to the engine?

https://forums.clubrsx.com/showthread.php?t=1144338

Raf99 10-16-2018 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CyborgGT (Post 3285898)
Do you have a ground running from the battery to the engine?

https://forums.clubrsx.com/showthread.php?t=1144338

No. And hmmmm. yaaa... I've been sitting here reading for 2 hours now & u my friend have a good point. You have to have a complete circuit! Fine for low impedance "accessories" to use vehicle ground. But the spark plugs, alternator, starter, all use the block as a ground to complete the circuit.

https://www.w8ji.com/negative_lead_to_battery.htm

https://ls1tech.com/forums/stereo-el...ound-wire.html

I'm still reading trying to determine the symptoms one would see if they didn't directly ground battery to engine. Is it that your alternator simply has to work harder when there's no proper return ground?

CyborgGT 10-17-2018 06:01 AM

I think the starter needs the most current of anything on the vehicle, and from what I understand both the alternator and the starter primarily pass current through the block. "Path of least resistance" and all that, they've got a lot more resistance to draw through if they've only got the chassis grounds to work with. And then I'm not sure if issues arise if that chassis-ground-only current has to back-track through other components, some live, some not. I've read a few domestic forums/tech sites that say to ground the battery in the trunk to the frame, then from the frame up front to the engine block, but I'm not sure if a unibody provides as solid a ground (or if it makes a difference at all). I don't know, I'm definitely not an electrical pro, so hopefully someone with more knowledge can chime in. Honda grounds the battery to both the chassis and the engine block from the factory, though. If it were me, I'd run two grounds off the battery: one to chassis and one all the way to the block, then two from the block to the chassis.

Doing some searching, I'm reading that insufficient grounding can also cause electrolysis in the coolant, and even degrade the aluminum in the radiator! I wonder if an iron block vs an aluminum block makes a difference in that, with the possibility of dissimilar metals between engine and radiator...

toycar 10-17-2018 03:40 PM

Whip out a meter and check amperage coming through on the heater.

Something is pulling amperage over 180 to blow the fuse

When voltage drops, amperage spikes. Keep that in mind.

My money is on a ground issue personally, but you have so much work done here it's hard to just assume one thing or another.

It's a hard sell that the blower is singularly responsible. What all is on the circuit that could pull that kind of amperage? I dont think upping to 200 amps is the answer

Is this issue new since the wire tuck/engine bay project?

Raf99 10-18-2018 09:15 PM

I don't have the tools to test the alternator amp draw.

I do know what causes it to happen and the final straw is turning the blower motor on high. So one would argue that it has an issue. I agree with ya'all & I'm not going to install the 200amp breaker. I think the whole wiring system needs an overhaul. When you look at this drawing below of what I did change you also have to add that the two stereo amps hang directly off the battery pulling alot of amps.

I'm guessing the alternator is working overtime to charge the battery (which quickly drains + is not replenished properly due to no negative cable return to the block) + fuse box essentials (blower motor, lights, etc.). Not sure the total is 180+ though but the distance is far.

http://clevercomputersolutions.ca/cb...018_214537.jpg

If I still blow the 180amp circuit breaker with this setup it's time to invest in some better tools and/or pull the blower motor out and test it.

toycar 10-19-2018 06:41 PM

Do you run a capacitor on your stereo? Disconnect the amp(s) power supply and see if you still have the issue

Are you wired in correct ohms for your speakers/among setup? Could have an impact too.

Not sure what you've got going on in detail for amps, but you may want to look into this

Raf99 10-20-2018 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toycar (Post 3285992)
Do you run a capacitor on your stereo? Disconnect the amp(s) power supply and see if you still have the issue

Are you wired in correct ohms for your speakers/among setup? Could have an impact too.

Not sure what you've got going on in detail for amps, but you may want to look into this

So that fix i did resolved the issue from what I can see/tested. But I still plan on running a 2AWG for the negative battery terminal from the trans to the block.

sonikaccord 10-20-2018 01:31 PM

180 amp fuse is blowing?

At a 14.4v charging voltage and 180 amp draw, that's over 2500w of power.

Let's say your battery is old and dying...at that same 2500w at 10v, you are going to be drawing 250 amps, which I think is enough to trip your breaker. Also the alternator can put out more current at a lower voltage as well.

If you have a basic multimeter, turn each item on and watch how severe the voltage drop is with each item. I say start with the blower motor first. You can put your black probe on different grounds of the car too. If the readings have a drastic change, then your grounds aren't "equal."

cp[mike] 10-20-2018 01:55 PM

you may be experiencing voltage drop over the length of the cable. I know the chart says 2 or 4 should be fine but in my experience with the trunk-mounted battery, not all cable is made the same, and I needed to use quality 0 gauge wire to be able to transport enough juice to the starter. I believed 180amp "should be fine" but kept having problems with my starter, and discovered it sucked 200+ (seemingly) during initial spinup with the solenoid extended, especially on a higher compression motor.

I HIGHLY recommend Kolossus Flex cable:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0050WZX0U

Raf99 10-21-2018 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonikaccord (Post 3286017)
180 amp fuse is blowing?

At a 14.4v charging voltage and 180 amp draw, that's over 2500w of power.

Let's say your battery is old and dying...at that same 2500w at 10v, you are going to be drawing 250 amps, which I think is enough to trip your breaker. Also the alternator can put out more current at a lower voltage as well.

If you have a basic multimeter, turn each item on and watch how severe the voltage drop is with each item. I say start with the blower motor first. You can put your black probe on different grounds of the car too. If the readings have a drastic change, then your grounds aren't "equal."

"....... then your grounds aren't equal". I think this sums the issue up. Yep I hear ya. And let's assume the amps are draining the battery fairly quick and the ALT is barely keeping up, I think the blower motor puts it over the top. I installed the volt meter in the dash and I can see the voltage drop as I turn things on. If I remember correctly the voltage drops to 13.1V when I turn it on (with other things on). But I think you want the voltage drop off the ALT wire?

Quote:

Originally Posted by cp[mike] (Post 3286018)
you may be experiencing voltage drop over the length of the cable. I know the chart says 2 or 4 should be fine but in my experience with the trunk-mounted battery, not all cable is made the same, and I needed to use quality 0 gauge wire to be able to transport enough juice to the starter. I believed 180amp "should be fine" but kept having problems with my starter, and discovered it sucked 200+ (seemingly) during initial spinup with the solenoid extended, especially on a higher compression motor.

I HIGHLY recommend Kolossus Flex cable:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0050WZX0U

Thanks man! Excalibur and I were talking about ya yesterday :)
And I hear ya, hence a battery will deliver 500+ CCA (cold cranking amps) to a starter (dead of winter, cold oil, etc.) but I'll never see that. My lights don't dim when the bass hits. I never have slow starts, my voltage always shows normal.

I will get this cable for the ground, but I'll use 2AWG. I'll run it from the trans ground to the battery. Start with one little change first. But question is, should I keep the ground that currently goes from the battery to the body (in the trunk)?



I think the other key factor here is that circuit breaker I was using. Cheap ebay boat type one. And in the old setup I had the fuse box and battery connected on the bolt of that breaker. Not the best spot for them to fight over power delivery. Not sure how this would blow the ALT breaker as I would assume the opposite would happen (lack of power).
But after changing things to the new diagram and testing, I cannot get the breaker to blow.

Raf99 10-26-2018 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CyborgGT (Post 3285926)
......... If it were me, I'd run two grounds off the battery: one to chassis and one all the way to the block, then two from the block to the chassis..........

Ya. I'm going to do this. It will take the path of least resistance either way.

My question is. Does the "loop" of electricity from the major components that ground to the block (starter/alt/plugs) which grounds to the battery, HELP in the charging or holding of charge of the battery itself?

CyborgGT 10-26-2018 05:33 PM

I'm not sure if I get the question, or if you're over thinking things and it's making you brain-fart the basics (god, that reads like such an asshole remark, but I really don't mean it that way!), but the alternator topping off the battery, as with every other electrical component on the car, relies on proper grounding to carry the correct voltage through the entire circuit. As Mike was saying, the further away from the action that you place the battery, the less effective the same gauge wire is going to be, so when grounding the block from as far away as the trunk, you'll want to make sure enough juice is being carried. It makes the most sense to me to take the factory arrangement and simply extend, and enlarge where necessary. That in mind, a chassis ground alone doesn't seem like enough; Honda certainly didn't think so.

sonikaccord 10-26-2018 07:36 PM

Yes it helps in charging by reducing resistive losses. The better the "loop" (good loop = lots of area for electron pixies to dance...thick wires and good chassis ground points), the more efficient the entire circuit is. You lose less of your electricity to heat.


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