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1991 Accord LX Race Car

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    #91
    I got a little bonus at work today and now I'm already thinking ahead to the next race. I'm planning on finishing out the rest of the 30hp for $500 plan. We already did the a4 header, race muffler, and the prelude ecu. Next would be the a6 cam, the a6 computer, the h23 intake, and the black box. I'll probably also replace the cat with a straight pipe and plumb in an improved intake.

    I was thinking about taking the stock intake pipe and air box from the same prelude si that I get the IM from. The air box is bigger so the bigger filter will flow better. I figure if I relocate the battery to the passenger compartment there will be room for the bigger air box. I've already replaced the right headlight with a scoop for my cold air / ram inlet so I can plum that into the new air box.

    I'm also figuring that instead of just buying a cam from an f22a6, I'll take the whole head. That way I get the stiffer stock springs. We rev this baby and i don't want the more aggressive cam floating the valves at speed.

    So since I'll be swapping out the head anyway, I am wondering if someone sold a good but extra thin head gasket to bump up the compression a little bit. Does anyone know the thickness of the stock gasket? I found the Bismoto thin gasket and I'm considering that possibility. If I know the stock thickness I could calculate the improvement in the compression ratio to see if it is worth the $119 for the gasket. Are there other alternatives out there?
    ==========================
    1991 Accord Lemons Race Car, "The Minnow" RIP
    1993 Accord Lemons Race Car, "SpaceEx Starship"
    Neuspeed Race Springs, Koni Sports, Acura CL Rear Sway Bar,
    Adj Upper Control Arms -3.0deg front, -2.0 deg rear
    M2A4 Trans, Cusco 1-way Limited Slip Differential, Stage 2 Clutch and 11lb flywheel. A4 Header, 2" exhaust all the way back, catalyst delete, delta 262 grind, glasspack muffler, PT6 ECU.
    Acura CL3.0 Brakes Front and Rear, Raybestos St43 Pads, Redline 600 Brake Fluid

    Comment


      #92
      I put in a Prelude Si intake tube and air box on my car. I also put in a smaller battery, so the box fit fine without my having to move the battery to a different location. If you take out the intake resonator, it will save you about 6 pounds on the front of the car (and might even help airflow a touch).

      Comment


        #93
        Originally posted by wagon-r View Post
        If you take out the intake resonator, it will save you about 6 pounds on the front of the car (and might even help airflow a touch).
        When we bought the car it had been hit on the front right in its only race. The resonator box was shattered. I tore it all out and used aluminum dryer hose to plumb from a modified air box to inside the fender. I blocked off the top of the space, removed the front right light, made an intake duct. Now I get a ram air effect pushing air into the intake. I know I have some closeups somewhere but I can't find them. But you can see it here.



        Any thoughts or suggestions about a thin gasket?
        Last edited by ukemike; 07-20-2016, 11:23 PM.
        ==========================
        1991 Accord Lemons Race Car, "The Minnow" RIP
        1993 Accord Lemons Race Car, "SpaceEx Starship"
        Neuspeed Race Springs, Koni Sports, Acura CL Rear Sway Bar,
        Adj Upper Control Arms -3.0deg front, -2.0 deg rear
        M2A4 Trans, Cusco 1-way Limited Slip Differential, Stage 2 Clutch and 11lb flywheel. A4 Header, 2" exhaust all the way back, catalyst delete, delta 262 grind, glasspack muffler, PT6 ECU.
        Acura CL3.0 Brakes Front and Rear, Raybestos St43 Pads, Redline 600 Brake Fluid

        Comment


          #94
          Great progress!

          I'll have many transmission questions for you soon


          I'll quickly reply about a few things.. I have the F22A1 as well. So I put the A6 cam in with the stock A1 springs and we have no problems with valve float. You really don't want to be revving over 6500 anyway in endurance racing.
          I'm really happy with the A6 cam, at first I couldn't really tell, but after getting it on track for our last race, the motor is much freer revving above 5000. It's most definitely worth it. Make sure you adjust the valves really well. I was lazy about it and first and they were so loose it sounded like a diesel.

          I used an A6 intake manifold and black box, and that's a great upgrade too. I would do the H22 upper if I could do it again, but this one was free. I blocked off the EGR and all the idle compensation stuff while I was at it.

          I also removed the balance shaft belts and cut down the pulley.

          this


          to this




          For the oil pan, I dont have pics but when it was off I made some fancy trap door baffles.

          When I tried to install them, they interfered with the oil pump pick up.. In the end I was able to weld a simple baffle at an angle where the shallow part of the pan radius starts curving down. It's not ideal but it's better than nothing. We still get starvation on certain left hand corners though


          Next time I have the pan out I'm goign to either do something like this
          http://passwordjdm.com/PasswordJDM-O...P2836C325.aspx

          or better yet, cut the rear of the sump out and make it larger like this:

          http://www.jegs.com/i/Moroso/710/20912/10002/-1

          This is an actual sump for our F22, but it's not worth $500, and would be pretty obvious to judges

          Comment


            #95
            You can always have the head milled iirc maximum is .040 so .030 is where I'd go just incase you ever over heat. Don't forget to replace them head bolts while your at it.

            02 Crv
            02 silverado Ex cab Z71, 2011 TRD 17" wheels, 245/80/17, ls1 cam, AFE intake, 3" catback, tuned by Larry at LSXperformance&pcm tuning driven daily.
            92 Acura Legend colbalt blue LS Coupe, custom intake, custom vibrant 2.5 cat back, led cluster and high beams, 2016 Coyote GT 18x8 wheels 235/40/18.
            Coming Soon Tein TSX coilovers.

            Comment


              #96
              Day 1 of Arse-Sweat-Apalooza done

              We had an eventful and very hot day at Thunderhill. Trying to blog it at

              picknpullracing.wordpress.com

              We were in 28th at one point until we had to replace a front axle. Ended the day in the paddock covered in grease sweating away turning wrenches and in 63rd.

              I'll put the whole story up here sometime this week.
              Last edited by ukemike; 07-31-2016, 09:56 AM.
              ==========================
              1991 Accord Lemons Race Car, "The Minnow" RIP
              1993 Accord Lemons Race Car, "SpaceEx Starship"
              Neuspeed Race Springs, Koni Sports, Acura CL Rear Sway Bar,
              Adj Upper Control Arms -3.0deg front, -2.0 deg rear
              M2A4 Trans, Cusco 1-way Limited Slip Differential, Stage 2 Clutch and 11lb flywheel. A4 Header, 2" exhaust all the way back, catalyst delete, delta 262 grind, glasspack muffler, PT6 ECU.
              Acura CL3.0 Brakes Front and Rear, Raybestos St43 Pads, Redline 600 Brake Fluid

              Comment


                #97
                49th out of 115

                It was sooo hot. On Saturday we sent Tedd out first. Tedd is our experienced racer. He set the day's fast lap of 2:25. Derek, who didn't get to drive at the last race, which was also his second ever, had his pick of which turn and he took the second stint. He did great. His times started out at 2:40 and got steadily faster till he was under 2:30. But he complained of a shaking under cornering. He thought it was from the back but that didn't make sense. I was eating and missed that stop. Tedd told him to go back out and come in if it got worse. Later he did come back in. We checked the axle nuts and the left was a bit loose. We tightened it and sent him out again and it was better. Dennis was next and was getting consistent 2:27s to 2:29s. Awesome. He came in for the shake too and we tightened the nut again. He came in after about an hour. He was suffering from the start of heat exhaustion and it was shaking again. I had to suit up extra fast while Tedd and Derek attended to the car. I did about 4 laps before the shaking started to get really bad. I came in they torqued it again and I went out. I got no more than 4 and it was shaking so bad that I gave up and retired for the day.



                Now if you know your stuff, you're thinking CV joint and you'd be right. A few weeks back I made a fateful decision. I thought that we'd pressed our luck too much, so I ordered a front axle off rockauto. It listed the same part for right and left side, but I believe they are different. Regardless we had a new axle ready to install. We sent Dennis and Derek for a new wheel bearing/hub (the store price for those was unbelievable). Tedd and I took apart the left side (we'd turned them and determined it was the left). We got the old axle out and started putting the new one in only to discover that the splines on the new axle were an inch too short. I wouldn't go in. So we took apart the inner joint of the old one and found the cup/spline part wasn't chewed up on the inside and we swapped it onto the old axle. It went right in. Tedd and I got dinner and met Dennis and Derek back at the track at 8:30pm. We had to hammer the bearing onto the hub and it was a very tight fit. That took an hour to get it close enough. Then I had to put it all back together. I got about 15 mosquito bites on my ankles and feet that night.



                In the morning when we started the car to get Dennis out on the pre-grid the alternator belt screamed like a stuck pig. So we took a look and the whole adjusment braket was gone. It must have rattled off. We tried to use the similar bracket from the PS pump. Doesn't fit. We tried to use plumbers tape to pull it up since it is below horizontal it actually cams out a bit at the right position so that idea wouldn't work. We eventually decided to pull the alternator up as hard as we could and overtighten the mounting bolt, then re-do it at every stop. It worked. And the new axle worked. Dennis got out there 30 minutes late and beat Tedd's fast time from Saturday with a 2:24.6. Then Derek went out and did great with consistent 2:27s. Tedd went out and proved beat Dennis' time with a 2:24.1. I finally got to drive the last stint from 2 to 3:30pm. It was over 100 out by then. I Put two quart freezer bags full of ice in my suit. It handles brilliantly. Don't tell anyone at lemons but the LSD it totally transformative. If you find yourself plowing wide in a turn mash on the throttle and crank the wheel around and it will pull you back in line. The launch from slow turns was brilliant. I was able to stay ahead of a faster e30 for several laps because my turn exits speeds were so fast he could only just catch me by then end of the straights and forget about the twisty bits. By the end of the day I worked my way to to taking turn 1 flat out (well just a little lift before entering). That's about 85 and uses every bit of the track. Scary as hell. About half of the cars brake for 1 so you can pass much faster cars there. Turn 6 is another one that can be taken flat out but many slow for it. I had a blast. I have no idea how good my lap times were. I have to wait for the detailed timing data sometime this week.

                We finished in 49th overall and 20th in B class with 232 laps. I was so tired for the almost 3 hour drive home.

                ==========================
                1991 Accord Lemons Race Car, "The Minnow" RIP
                1993 Accord Lemons Race Car, "SpaceEx Starship"
                Neuspeed Race Springs, Koni Sports, Acura CL Rear Sway Bar,
                Adj Upper Control Arms -3.0deg front, -2.0 deg rear
                M2A4 Trans, Cusco 1-way Limited Slip Differential, Stage 2 Clutch and 11lb flywheel. A4 Header, 2" exhaust all the way back, catalyst delete, delta 262 grind, glasspack muffler, PT6 ECU.
                Acura CL3.0 Brakes Front and Rear, Raybestos St43 Pads, Redline 600 Brake Fluid

                Comment


                  #98
                  Great write up! Sounds like the standard lemons experience I gotta swap my trans before our next race, Buttonwillow Oct 1st. You gonna be there?!

                  Being in San Diego, I can't do those up north races very much. Anything more than a 4 hour drive there and back is brutal. Sonoma is 7-8 hours and Thunderhill is 9+
                  Last edited by aventari; 08-08-2016, 02:25 AM.

                  Comment


                    #99
                    Originally posted by aventari View Post
                    Great write up! Sounds like the standard lemons experience I gotta swap my trans before our next race, Buttonwillow Oct 1st. You gonna be there?!

                    Being in San Diego, I can't do those up north races very much. Anything more than a 4 hour drive there and back is brutal. Sonoma is 7-8 hours and Thunderhill is 9+
                    And never the twain shall meet...

                    We talked about July Thunderhill versus September Buttonwillow and we chose to do Thunderhill. Time and budget kept us from doing both. Maybe next year I can encourage the team to try Buttonwillow instead so we can have an Accord Showdown. We've also considered trying the LuckyDog Racing at Laguna Seca. Racing there is a dream that I never thought I would fulfill and now it's only a fire suppression system away.
                    ==========================
                    1991 Accord Lemons Race Car, "The Minnow" RIP
                    1993 Accord Lemons Race Car, "SpaceEx Starship"
                    Neuspeed Race Springs, Koni Sports, Acura CL Rear Sway Bar,
                    Adj Upper Control Arms -3.0deg front, -2.0 deg rear
                    M2A4 Trans, Cusco 1-way Limited Slip Differential, Stage 2 Clutch and 11lb flywheel. A4 Header, 2" exhaust all the way back, catalyst delete, delta 262 grind, glasspack muffler, PT6 ECU.
                    Acura CL3.0 Brakes Front and Rear, Raybestos St43 Pads, Redline 600 Brake Fluid

                    Comment


                      Build f or H series.

                      F22a6 worth rebuilding and boosting vs. swapping a H22a1 vtec?

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Cb792EXbuilder View Post
                        F22a6 worth rebuilding and boosting vs. swapping a H22a1 vtec?
                        Nothing will land a Honda in A class faster than VTEC. SOHC totally stock looking boooring early 90's motor is what we want. We put a VTEC in there and all of the sudden the judges will be sweating us for every detail of our car, when right now they pop the hood, say "this ain't winning anything" and give us B class with no penalty laps. We like B class.

                        Plus the thing people don't get, lots more horsepower means more wear on everything so parts break more often. CV joints, bearings, transmissions, motor mounts, motors, all of it. It means you need better brakes to slow you down at the end of straights, it means you chew up the tires faster, it means you burn more fuel. All of that costs money that could have been spent on tires, brake pads, and the next race's entry fees. The cb7/f22 is perfect for low budget lemons racing.

                        Also I hate to say it but VTEC motors don't do that well in Lemons. They're always blowing up or spinning bearings. I don't think it is necessarily that VTEC motors are unreliable but that the VTEC motors that can be bought for Lemons money aren't likely to be reliable.
                        ==========================
                        1991 Accord Lemons Race Car, "The Minnow" RIP
                        1993 Accord Lemons Race Car, "SpaceEx Starship"
                        Neuspeed Race Springs, Koni Sports, Acura CL Rear Sway Bar,
                        Adj Upper Control Arms -3.0deg front, -2.0 deg rear
                        M2A4 Trans, Cusco 1-way Limited Slip Differential, Stage 2 Clutch and 11lb flywheel. A4 Header, 2" exhaust all the way back, catalyst delete, delta 262 grind, glasspack muffler, PT6 ECU.
                        Acura CL3.0 Brakes Front and Rear, Raybestos St43 Pads, Redline 600 Brake Fluid

                        Comment


                          Thunderhill Video

                          Video for all day Saturday is up on youtube.

                          Our first driver, Tedd. He's our ringer.
                          If you want to see how fast a CB7 can be driven:


                          Here are Derek's and Dennis' drives.




                          Finally my inauspicious Saturday drive. If you want to see what it looks like when a CV joint is failing skip to 27:30 and watch my hands shake.
                          ==========================
                          1991 Accord Lemons Race Car, "The Minnow" RIP
                          1993 Accord Lemons Race Car, "SpaceEx Starship"
                          Neuspeed Race Springs, Koni Sports, Acura CL Rear Sway Bar,
                          Adj Upper Control Arms -3.0deg front, -2.0 deg rear
                          M2A4 Trans, Cusco 1-way Limited Slip Differential, Stage 2 Clutch and 11lb flywheel. A4 Header, 2" exhaust all the way back, catalyst delete, delta 262 grind, glasspack muffler, PT6 ECU.
                          Acura CL3.0 Brakes Front and Rear, Raybestos St43 Pads, Redline 600 Brake Fluid

                          Comment


                            upgraded brake problems

                            I got the knuckles off an acura CL3.0 with the assumption that they would hold the calipers in the right position for the 11.1" diameter disks. But once we got them on the car the calipers bottom out and cannot line up with the caliper bolt holes on the knuckles. :-(

                            I'm thinking I need to go back and get calipers from an acura cl3.0, but those will almost certainly be nissin calipers, and race pads are not readily available for the nissins :-(

                            Any suggestions?
                            ==========================
                            1991 Accord Lemons Race Car, "The Minnow" RIP
                            1993 Accord Lemons Race Car, "SpaceEx Starship"
                            Neuspeed Race Springs, Koni Sports, Acura CL Rear Sway Bar,
                            Adj Upper Control Arms -3.0deg front, -2.0 deg rear
                            M2A4 Trans, Cusco 1-way Limited Slip Differential, Stage 2 Clutch and 11lb flywheel. A4 Header, 2" exhaust all the way back, catalyst delete, delta 262 grind, glasspack muffler, PT6 ECU.
                            Acura CL3.0 Brakes Front and Rear, Raybestos St43 Pads, Redline 600 Brake Fluid

                            Comment


                              I just ended up getting the calipers with the 25t brakcets off another acura cl 3.0. Now we have to order our pads to be made for us from Porterfield. Also got the sway bar off a Vigor and mounted it. That should be cool
                              ==========================
                              1991 Accord Lemons Race Car, "The Minnow" RIP
                              1993 Accord Lemons Race Car, "SpaceEx Starship"
                              Neuspeed Race Springs, Koni Sports, Acura CL Rear Sway Bar,
                              Adj Upper Control Arms -3.0deg front, -2.0 deg rear
                              M2A4 Trans, Cusco 1-way Limited Slip Differential, Stage 2 Clutch and 11lb flywheel. A4 Header, 2" exhaust all the way back, catalyst delete, delta 262 grind, glasspack muffler, PT6 ECU.
                              Acura CL3.0 Brakes Front and Rear, Raybestos St43 Pads, Redline 600 Brake Fluid

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by ukemike View Post
                                Video for all day Saturday is up on youtube.

                                Our first driver, Tedd. He's our ringer.
                                If you want to see how fast a CB7 can be driven:


                                Here are Derek's and Dennis' drives.




                                Finally my inauspicious Saturday drive. If you want to see what it looks like when a CV joint is failing skip to 27:30 and watch my hands shake.
                                Nice! That car sounds really good on acceleration too.

                                Comment

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