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CyborgGT: Mild H22A Build

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    #31
    So in other words, he might want to keep it at 11.5:1? If all other variables constant, a 12.5:1 motor in Florida would be fine on 93, but in Colorado it might require 100?
    '94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq

    Originally posted by deevergote
    If you say double dutch rudder, i'm banning you...

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      #32
      Originally posted by Joey GT-R View Post
      So in other words, he might want to keep it at 11.5:1? If all other variables constant, a 12.5:1 motor in Florida would be fine on 93, but in Colorado it might require 100?
      It all depends on the tuner, you can tune a 12.5:1 on 93 safely in Colorado....but it won't make the power of the exact same setup tuned in FL. e85 is in pretty much every city now, you could safely tune 13:1 at higher altitudes and squeeze the max out.
      My Member's Ride Thread

      Bisimoto header before & after dyno

      1993 10th Anniversary: F22a6, H23IM, Bisimoto header, Custom mandrel exhaust, 5spd swap.

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        #33
        Okay, before I go pouring money into parts I guess I should make sure I know what exact engine I have. Does the "No.3 97" stamp behind the header mean I have a 1997 H22A? And are there going to be any slight differences between JDM and USDM engines of the same model year? Like for instance, I can't remember which ones were open deck or closed deck. I want to be sure anything I get from Majestic or HondaPartsUnlimited will work for me.

        But it's out now!


        Accord Aero-R

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          #34
          Yes you have a 97 H22A1. I believe the compression on that is still 10:1. As far as I know, all USDM H22As were open deck. Only the JDMs came in a closed deck variant. Parts will all be the same regardless of the deck. You will have OBD2 specific parts of course but other than that mechanically they are the same. But the closed deck form is regarded as being better for boost. However that "issue" can be solved by simply sleeving the motor.
          '94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq

          Originally posted by deevergote
          If you say double dutch rudder, i'm banning you...

          Comment


            #35
            Mine is JDM. I've always known them to be 10.6:1, and some searching reported that all 97-01 motors were open-deck, while all pre-97 models were closed-deck. The engine came with all the OBD1 parts (obviously; I had it running), but had what I figured to be an OBD2 intake manifold, which would make sense now that I know the block's a '97 too. Now, is a block guard a worth-while investment or should I not worry about that with such little power? Or is out-of-roundness really an issue with age?
            Last edited by CyborgGT; 09-21-2012, 02:32 AM.

            Accord Aero-R

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              #36
              Okay, I didn't realize you had a JDM motor. Then yes, 10.6:1-11.0:1 is the range of the JDM engines. But I nor anyone I've known has been able to decode the pattern in which the higher compression H22As are produced. My JDM H22A has 11.1:1 actually, and it's a 94. But I'm not sure why.

              A block guard is really like a "band-aid" to your "problem". The block guard is only at the top of the block, it doesn't fill in all the space in the water jacket all the way down. Block guards can leak, and cause issues. While I've never experienced this problem personally, I have seen it occur on many B-Series setups, because to my knowledge they are all open deck as a shortcut to sleeving. However I've never seen an H-Series do it, and when the block guards fail it was all due to forced induction, not an all motor setup. And I've only seen block guards used for boosted builds period. For your build I wouldn't bother. If you want to do any kind of major build, more than likely you need to sleeve, and not add a block guard.
              '94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq

              Originally posted by deevergote
              If you say double dutch rudder, i'm banning you...

              Comment


                #37
                Originally posted by Joey GT-R View Post
                Okay, I didn't realize you had a JDM motor. Then yes, 10.6:1-11.0:1 is the range of the JDM engines. But I nor anyone I've known has been able to decode the pattern in which the higher compression H22As are produced. My JDM H22A has 11.1:1 actually, and it's a 94. But I'm not sure why.

                A block guard is really like a "band-aid" to your "problem". The block guard is only at the top of the block, it doesn't fill in all the space in the water jacket all the way down. Block guards can leak, and cause issues. While I've never experienced this problem personally, I have seen it occur on many B-Series setups, because to my knowledge they are all open deck as a shortcut to sleeving. However I've never seen an H-Series do it, and when the block guards fail it was all due to forced induction, not an all motor setup. And I've only seen block guards used for boosted builds period. For your build I wouldn't bother. If you want to do any kind of major build, more than likely you need to sleeve, and not add a block guard.

                Block guards don't leak. Gaskets do, a absent minded install could cause some cyln warping, but it would have to e on the edge of complete ignorance for the guard itself to cause a leak.

                Im for them if you do it right. Few people heat cycle their blocks and then have them bored. But they are in no way as strong as sleeving. It just depends on the cost to the builder/enthusiast. If you can get a guard installed right for 200 including overbore, decking the block, line boreing and milling the head because you know people. Screw sleeves unless you got extra money or obsess over a prefect build.

                Water jackets only become a real problem when the guard is installed too close to the top of the block. Any closed deck engine runs hotter than an open deck, block guarded engines aren't as bad as a closed deck as far as cooling goes.

                Comment


                  #38
                  Originally posted by MortsAccord View Post
                  Block guards don't leak. Gaskets do, a absent minded install could cause some cyln warping, but it would have to e on the edge of complete ignorance for the guard itself to cause a leak.

                  Im for them if you do it right. Few people heat cycle their blocks and then have them bored. But they are in no way as strong as sleeving. It just depends on the cost to the builder/enthusiast. If you can get a guard installed right for 200 including overbore, decking the block, line boreing and milling the head because you know people. Screw sleeves unless you got extra money or obsess over a prefect build.

                  Water jackets only become a real problem when the guard is installed too close to the top of the block. Any closed deck engine runs hotter than an open deck, block guarded engines aren't as bad as a closed deck as far as cooling goes.
                  I'll take your word on it.

                  Since he's not doing a crazy build I believe the block guard isn't necessary. If anything he can do a Darton Dry or Wet Sleeve for around $700 installed. He can bore those out to 88-90mm without worrying about weakening the integrity of the sleeves. But I would like him to crack his open to see if he is even open deck in the first place. I've never seen a 97 JDM block before.....he might have the only option of sleeving. But he might be right in that it is open deck regardless of USDM or JDM.
                  '94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq

                  Originally posted by deevergote
                  If you say double dutch rudder, i'm banning you...

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Any H22A manufactured after 1996 has an open deck design. Regardless of whether it came from the US, Canada, Japan, Europe, Australia or Antarctica.
                    My Members' Ride Thread - It's a marathon build, not a sprint. But keep me honest on the update frequency!

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by bigpoppa694lyfe View Post
                      As for the rest of the gaskets, felpro should have a "conversion" set that contains all your bottom end gaskets and you can easily piece together the rest
                      I did end up finding this kit, and for a pretty good price. Arrived in the mail today. I also picked up an engine stand yesterday so I can start taking the engine apart and cleaning everything up in preparation for the build.

                      One thing about my build that's had me nervous is upgrading the fuel system. I know nothing about supplying fuel to any amount of power, and the different specs of injectors, pumps, and FPRs. Once the gaskets are taken care of, I think I'll go ahead piecing together the exhaust system since I'm sure of what I want. That bill is going to be a doosy.
                      Last edited by CyborgGT; 10-03-2012, 11:58 PM.

                      Accord Aero-R

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                        #41
                        While I admit I am too a noob to fuel delivery, I've picked up a little bit along the way. You don't need too much with this build. A fuel rail isn't necessary, the stock flows fine. I believe LoDollar as well as NWaccord are both using the stock rails for their 500whp+ turbo monsters. The AEM & BDL fuel rails do have existing ports for nitrous though if you ever consider going down that road. Otherwise, it's more of a "bling piece". As far as injectors, I wouldn't go above 600cc, and that supports roughly 400whp. A chart that I sometimes use for reference is this one by Precision. As for the fuel pump, a simple Walbro 255lph should be all you need. These components should ensure your engine isn't starving for fuel at high rpm.
                        '94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq

                        Originally posted by deevergote
                        If you say double dutch rudder, i'm banning you...

                        Comment


                          #42
                          Great, thanks for that link. I took a quick look around Honda-Tech and I'm surprised I did't see anything with the rest of the Prelude/H22 info. Going with Precision injectors (if I do, I know they've got a great reputation), it looks like 440cc's should be enough, but 525's would be a nice, safe choice I think.

                          Accord Aero-R

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                            #43
                            http://mysite.verizon.net/vzezeqah/s...uelsystems.pdf

                            Your welcome.

                            Comment


                              #44
                              And I do thank you very much indeed, I like how it relates the info to engine builds.

                              Accord Aero-R

                              Comment


                                #45
                                Originally posted by Joey GT-R View Post
                                As far as I know, all USDM H22As were open deck. Only the JDMs came in a closed deck variant.
                                You were correct in this. The bulk of the teardown was done today. I was annoyed to discover I had to take apart all the cam parts to get to the head bolts, relieved when none of them were seized, and then ecstatic to find a closed deck under the gasket .










                                Accord Aero-R

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