Building an h22 with an f22 block?

[Miho1269]

Im in the process of finding an h22 to swap into my cb. I found one that is complete but has a hole in the block. my question is if its possible to build my f22 to the same specs of the h22. Im basically wanting to have a completely stock h22 with an f22a1 block. Any direction would be great thanks.

[Jarrett]

Why is it that an search would not be your first course of action? The F22A is an 85mm bore and can be bored to 86mm at the max. That won't accept H22A pistons. Also, there are two oil drain holes present on the H22A head that are not there on the F22A block. The rest of them don't really match perfectly. The diameter of the H22A combustion chamber is 87mm to match the bore of the H22A cylinders. To put that head on the F22A block, even with an 86mm bore performed, would create a ridge on the cylinder that would be a breeding ground for hot spots.

Why can't you just repair your current block?

[92smokeaccord]

j yard blocks are dirt cheap.you can use any year h22/23 block.

[Miho1269]

Why is it that an search would not be your first course of action? The F22A is an 85mm bore and can be bored to 86mm at the max. That won't accept H22A pistons. Also, there are two oil drain holes present on the H22A head that are not there on the F22A block. The rest of them don't really match perfectly. The diameter of the H22A combustion chamber is 87mm to match the bore of the H22A cylinders. To put that head on the F22A block, even with an 86mm bore performed, would create a ridge on the cylinder that would be a breeding ground for hot spots.

Why can't you just repair your current block?

You mean repairing the whole in the h22 block? How would i go about repairing a hole thats like 4 square inches in size without any of the pieces? It would be really hard to weld on cast aluminum and why would anyone want to put an h22 head on an f22 block if the bore size is 2mm off?

[Miho1269]

j yard blocks are dirt cheap.you can use any year h22/23 block.

After searching for 7 hours in every junkyard i could find in omaha i only saw 2 preludes and they both had f22.

[Jarrett]

If it's that big, then no, you can't repair it. I have an F20B block with a thrown rod and it popped a hole the size of a dime in the case window. I'll repair it soon. I meant it as a question and not a suggestion so you gave me the answer I wanted, but I should have worded it differently so you didn't think I was just telling you to go repair it regardless of damage.

92smokeaccord's suggestion is great. At any given time, here in Houston, I can go to a junkyard and find a Prelude with an H23A1. That block would be great for you to use your rotating assembly in. Aside from oil squirters and an oil drain plug for VTEC to function located in the deck of the block it's the same thing. In fact, you could jsut use the whole H23A1 rotating assembly also for a big gain in torque.

[deevergote]

"big gain in torque" is relative to these small-displacement 4 cylinder engines, though. The gain really isn't that significant.

The H/F hybrid/headswap/"g22"/whateveryouwanttocallit has been discussed literally DOZENS of times on this forum. How do I know? because I say the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over again in each one of them.

Using an F bottom end, complete with a rotating assembly that isn't made to rev to H22 levels, pistons that will yield a terribly low compression ratio, and a bore size that is too small for the H22 head's combustion chamber diameter (therefore leaving a sharp ridge in the blast zone, just begging to be a source of detonation)... that's just not a smart idea.

People HAVE done such swaps, and a handful have been successful (at least for a short while.) However, most people that have had any success at all have been experienced and knowledgeable enough to attempt the procedure without asking "how do i do this?" on a forum. If you have to ask people on a forum any of the more basic questions... you probably don't have what it takes to pull it off successfully. If you wanted to try, I'd only do it on a project car... not something you rely on. because chances are very good that it'll fail.



Let me ask you... WHY do you want to do this? Please don't tell me that it's because "the H has weak sleeves, and the F has bulletproof iron sleeves"... because that's a load of malarkey.
I assume that you just want to do the head swap because you found the busted H22 for cheap. Think of this though... if the block has a hole in it, do you really think the head is undamaged? It could be warped. The valves could be burnt or bent. The combustion chamber could be scored. The amount of force necessary to put a hole in a block would likely do damage elsewhere as well.

Save your milk money for a few months. Go to www.hmotorsonline.com and order an OBD1 JDM H22A (engine/ECU/transmission... LSD trans would be a very wise buy.) It won't be terribly cheap, but you'll get something you'll know you can rely on. Go cheap, and I assure you, your car will be in the junkyard by April.

[Ander]

The F22A is an 85mm bore and can be bored to 86mm at the max.

Just out of curiosity, why can the F22A only be bored to 86mm? Do you just run out of surface?

[deevergote]

Beyond that, the cylinder walls become dangerously thin. Especially considering the fact that the F22A is an open deck design.

[Jarrett]

The factory sleeves on most cars are designed to give just enough material to give the cylinder strength and then to favor the cooling system from that point on. Aftermarket sleeves require that the original sleeve plus some additional material as well be cut away in order to be installed. In that case the new sleeve is much thicker and can be bored to a greater diameter. The cooling system takes somewhat of a volume hit, though not terribly much.

[darkside92]

I was checking out that motor website that deev put up. I keeps reloading while I try to read it . Anybody else have this problem ?

[deevergote]

I never have... and it's been the exact same thing since I bought my H22 back in 2003!

What browser are you using? I use the newest Firefox, and it works flawlessly for me.

[PR CB7]

The F22A is an 85mm bore and can be bored to 86mm at the max

LIES!!!!!!!!!

87mm is the biggest you can go on any IRON SLEEVED F BLOCK

so yeah you can make a f22 into a h22, the only thing you wont get will be oil squirters

come on people, technology is only getting better, little by little people are experimenting and getting results
in 2003 you would be exiled from any forum by saying something as a h22 head fits on a f22 block

in 2004 saying a f22 head can outflow a b16 could get you shot...

in 2004 saying a f22head making 600+hp could have gotten you banned

saying a f22 block with h22 rods and k20 pistons would work and would own a k20 would have also gotten you shot

math works.... but it contradicts it self sometimes, math says a h22 head DOES NOT WORK on a f22, but we all know that it works

to the OP, your idea can work, but to do it right you must spend some money, and since you will be boring you might as well change your piston/rod combo, this way not only you will have a fresh motor, you will have a motor that will own ANY h22 out here but it will last longer
I CAN GUARANTEE IT

hopefully whenever you hit florida you will be able to see the light mike

[deevergote]

Oscar, you're the reason I say that bit about knowledge and experience.
I assure you, if I were to attempt a build like this, it would break in a month. Chances are good that anyone who has to ask "can it be done?" would be in the same boat.
If I recall, you NEVER made a thread on here, or any other forum, asking if it could be done. You knew the engines well enough to be able to look at them and figure out HOW to do it. You also had the knowledge and ability to understand that you might have to yank it out if it fails... and the ability to do that without having your car parked for 4 years.

[Jarrett]

The only person I've seen on this forum that I would trust to be able to safely bore an F22A to 87mm is Wes. He hasn't even finished it yet because of all the prep work necessary that he hasn't gotten time to do. Even then it's still an experiment. Have you bored yours to 87mm? We're not talking about the F23A bottom end here.

I have had both blocks sitting side by side for other comparison reasons and have seen that the sleeve thickness between OEM F23A sleeve and OEM F22A sleeve is nearly identical. To assume that one can only be bored out an additional mm and the other 2mm just to reach some magic number is silly. +2mm is .080". Find a SBF that can have a bore that large and still pass a sonic test with flying colors.

Oscar, I respect you, I really do, but you have yet to defend this topic with anything other than saying it can be done. Sure, but there are many more reasons not to and instead, to elect a proper alternative.