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F22A Upgrade Path

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    F22A Upgrade Path

    I’ve been a long time reader of cb7tuner.com but I’ve never posted. I have some decisions to make as what to do next with my car. It’s a 1990 Accord LX. The body still needs work and hopefully I’ll finish that up this summer. It’s only been on the list for the last 3 summers. I’ll list everything I can think of that has already been done and then list off what I plan to do shortly.

    Suspension:
    NuSpeed Race Springs
    KYB AGX struts
    Energy suspension front bushing kit
    Prothane rear bushing kit (also includes upper front control arm Energy Suspension bushing for the rear
    strut bushings, also the sleeves are welded in place per recommendation of this site)
    Trailing arm bushings
    Acura Vigor 16mm rear sway bar
    1990 EX front sway bar
    Front adjustable upper ball joints
    Rear adjustable upper control arms
    New tie rods
    Ebay front strut bar

    Brakes:
    ROH upgrade to 11.1” rotors 25mm thick (with new rotors, pads and calipers)
    Rear disc swap (with new rotors and pads)
    40/40 proportioning valve

    Engine:

    Rebuild
    85.5mm pistions (new)
    All new bearings/rings/seals
    Crankshaft was micropolished
    Rotating assembly was balanced (with ACT parts)

    ACT 12.5 lbs steel flywheel
    ACT Stage 3 clutch
    Bisimoto Valve springs and titanium retainers
    Bisimoto Stainless steel valve springs
    Bisimoto Intake Manifold gasket
    F20B crankshaft pulley
    P/S deleted
    Manual rack
    H23 IM manifold (soon to be ported and polished)
    Ebay SRI
    Ebay Header
    Balancer shaft deleted
    Magnaflow 2.25 catback
    Magnaflow 2.25 Highflow cat
    EGR blocked off
    FITV blocked off
    F22A6 camshaft
    PT3 ECU

    Interior:

    LED dash/interior
    1996 front and rear seats (originals are being reupholstered in leather very soon)


    I plan on keeping this an N/A build. So with that in mind here are some of the things I plan on getting next. My eventual goal with the car is 200-250whp.

    Bisimoto Stage 2 camshaft
    AEM V2 for the Prelude

    I was also thinking of buying either a Kamikaze, DC or Hedman Chikara Tork Stepped header. The ebay stainless steel header I bought, has caused some problems. I’m wanting to be rid of it. I had space out my A/C because it was hitting the lines after I got it in, the heat from the header actually melted a little bit of the aluminum A/C line even though it wasn’t touching it. Also having problems with gaskets on the downpipe. I just ordered the Hedman gasket for it to hold me over for the time being. I had another ebay header that was fine but the downpipe was partially crushed and the flex pipe was messed up due to other drivers running me off the road in winter. Sliding into the ditch backwards shortened up my exhaust about 6” and bent the inner walls of the flex pipe, couldn’t see daylight through it anymore.

    This is where I want some help at. Is it even worth buying a different header? This ebay POS has a 1 5/8” collector I believe. Can double check that. Would it be worth upgrading to either the DC or Hedman at all with a 2” collector? With the Kamikaze I can maintain a 2.25” exhaust all the way. If I go with the Kamikaze I know there would need to be some fabrication done to it immediately based on some of the feedback here. Mainly to add a bracket so it can be bolted to the back of the block, to avoid sagging causing the welds to crack. Also I don’t need any just save up the Bisimoto header. I really want the Bisimoto header but can’t afford $1349.00 for a header right now. It’s on my list in a year or two.

    Also I know very soon I’m going to have to get a chipped ecu and get a tune. I haven’t done any research into that yet. I’m not even sure where I would go for that yet. I live in MT and not very many people do a lot with Honda’s around here. I’m one of the few people around here to have a lot of work done for a Honda at the machine shops here in town.

    So what I’m wondering is should I spend the money I was thinking about spending on a better quality header and spend it elsewhere? A programmable ecu and try to get it tuned? Or suspension upgrades like the fender braces for the CD5 and a better front and rear upper strut bar?

    One last thing with the Bisimoto Stage 2 camshaft would it be worth running it with the PT3 or going with a P12? Both being stock mind you.

    Sorry for the very long winded post. But I figured to help make a better decision it would help to have as much of the information upfront as I could supply you. Thank you so much!
    MRT: 1993 Honda Accord SE Coupe (Lola)

    #2
    well a new ECU like a chipped p28 is around 200$ and in my opinion is a must to get the most out of your engine, i say 200$ but then you gotta get it tuned (dyno or street tune) so in the end it'll cost you a bit more then that... but its an affordable upgrade that will change everything!

    now i know this is probably not what you want to hear, but i must admit i dont understand the idea of putting so much money into an engine to get ''only'' 200-250 hp when for a fraction of what it cost you so far, you could have just swapped for an h22 and be already near those numbers...
    you say you want to keep this build N/A but with all the parts you put in the engine already, why not just go turbo??
    i mean...its almost begging for it! and you could get a lot more hp for cheaper then staying N/A

    MRT: http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=201008

    Comment


      #3
      You can't run the lvl 2 on a stock ecu, it's too aggressive.
      Someone is selling a bisi header in the classifieds.

      You posted alot of things unrelated to "f22a upgrade path" more concise post would attract more responses.

      Also your choices are personal decisions. Do you want your CB to handle well sooner? Or have more power sooner?

      Welcome to the site!

      YouTube Clicky!!

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Cb7_Qc View Post
        well a new ECU like a chipped p28 is around 200$ and in my opinion is a must to get the most out of your engine, i say 200$ but then you gotta get it tuned (dyno or street tune) so in the end it'll cost you a bit more then that... but its an affordable upgrade that will change everything!

        now i know this is probably not what you want to hear, but i must admit i dont understand the idea of putting so much money into an engine to get ''only'' 200-250 hp when for a fraction of what it cost you so far, you could have just swapped for an h22 and be already near those numbers...
        you say you want to keep this build N/A but with all the parts you put in the engine already, why not just go turbo??
        i mean...its almost begging for it! and you could get a lot more hp for cheaper then staying N/A
        200whp is cheaper than you think out of an f-series, you really cant include the cost of bolt-ons on the f22 but not the h22. on the turbo side of things, power isnt everything. i run 13.7's with my f23 nonvtec all motor with an unported head and a completely un-touched stock bottom end. for the price of an h22 i can buy a f23 bottom end, f22a6 head, a regind and valvesprings. from there on bolt-on for bolt-on im building more usable power on a dd. i have yet to see a turbo f22a touch me with less than 325whp. i like the h22 but anything one can do power wise they both can do. it takes the same work to get 240-250whp+ from an h22 as it does an f22. the h22 got lucky enough to come factory with 9.8-11:1 compression and aggressive camshafts. a bare bones jdm h22 can be had for $900 from most places, i can get a f23 bottom from any jdm distributor for $450, reuse your stock head for free, valvesprings for $190 and a regrind from web for $285 and that's the expensive route. so $25 more with the f23a/f22a to make 46wtq more and 18whp more based off similar bolt-ons. just to note most of the stock base jdm h22's make in the 190whp/150wtq on dynojet, i make roughly 206whp/191wtq on a superflow. ive proved it before that on the same dyno its even more rough.
        this is my build vs jdm h22 with hytech replica header, and the rest is nearly identical to mine. aem v2, skunk2 intake manifold, 66mm skunk2 TB and ktellar 2.5" piping kit with magnaflow muffler tuned on hondata S300 V2. this setup would easily be 196whp on a dynojet. this is probably the most accurate comparisson of the two you will ever find, these were only 30mins apart.
        Last edited by jdm92_accorn; 01-16-2014, 10:55 PM.

        MRT: http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=95154

        Comment


          #5
          PT3 ECU with a cam upgrade and the H23 intake manifold is a major power loser. Use a PT6 at the very least.

          You don't need a P28. You can use a P06. $50 for the ECU, or less if you can find it. $20 for the chipping kit. $15 for a soldering iron and necessary supplies if you don't have that already. Then you need to tune the ECU... that will be a few hundred for the necessary tools, or a few hundred to a professional. Don't blindly trust an enthusiast tuner that's willing to do it cheap.

          I've heard nothing but bad things about the quality of the Kamikaze header. A friend of mine installed one, and it leaked. My friend is one of the most meticulous people I know, so I have no doubt that he installed it correctly. It was just made poorly.
          Bisimoto's header is the only one that really makes power for the F22A. If you're doing a serious build from the inside out, I'd suggest getting one. There have been some quality and fitment issues for some people, but the gains still far surpass anything else.

          In the future, please be more specific in your thread titles. This thread nearly got deleted. Had it not been for the useful information provided by your fellow members, it would have been.

          Also, replace those struts. AGXs are a very poor match to Neuspeed Race springs.






          Comment


            #6
            Thanks for the reply's. Sorry for the bad thread name I just couldn't come up with anything else right then. Also sorry for the things unrelated to the engine in the post. But I wanted to give you guys an idea of what has been done where. So no one was suggesting to do something that has already been done.

            I do plan on getting a chipped ecu soon or suggesting what Deev said and chip it myself. I'm not really sure where I'm going to get it tuned at. Going to have to find somewhere decent hopefully within 400 miles.

            What struts are best paired with the springs? I didn't actually buy the springs, got them with the car. I would have gone with something a tad taller myself living in MT and driving on a lot of dirt roads.

            Also about the headers. I do plan on getting a Bisi header eventually just won't be for another year or so. I would like to get some of the other less expensive things done then I can add that later. So it looks like I should either pickup a DC or Hedman? Or just stick with the ebay header for the time being. I understand that it's my car and my choice in the end. I'm just looking for some constructive feedback now.

            Looked in the classified and did not see a Bisi header for sale.
            Last edited by Rilas; 01-17-2014, 11:44 AM.
            MRT: 1993 Honda Accord SE Coupe (Lola)

            Comment


              #7
              Koni Yellows (Koni Sport) or Tokico Illuminas would be much better with those springs. My choice would be the Konis. I recently had H&R Race springs on my car (with Koni Yellows), and it was also too low for me. I raised it up on Neuspeed Sport springs.

              A DC Sports header is a decent choice. Add a 2.5" collector to it, and you'll see some pretty good gains. Not quite Bisimoto levels, but about the best you'll do otherwise. Fitment will likely be better than Bisimoto as well.






              Comment


                #8
                I was thinking of swapping my f22a6 for a f20a dohc.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Why?






                  Comment


                    #10
                    I know with a p28 u can do datalogging with it and have a remote tune done if you can find anyone local

                    Comment

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