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Old 07-29-2015, 04:01 PM   #1
Straight Success
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Technical Documentation For Building A RWD CB7!

This topic has been brought up in many conversations over the past decade or so. There is evidence that these cars can be turned into RWD, and attempts by members who have poured many man hours into trying to build the next great RWD CB7 are currently being developed.

This thread will serve the purpose of engineering the CB7 platform to function as a RWD car. Tons of R&D will be documented here to blueprint/map out what's needed to embark on building one. A few years back I stated that I would be attempting to build one. Well, here's the beginning of that process. Also, I will be performing this with the intent of making the RWD CB chassis drivable and comfortable on a daily basis.

Quick background about me. I graduated from Temple University with a degree in mechanical engineering in 2013. I have been focusing my efforts over the past 3 years in becoming the best design/mechanical engineer I can be as this is always what I wanted to do. I also like to take what I design and actually build/manufacture it. To say in the least, I love doing this as a hobby and a career.

Advice is always welcome. Please post in the thread as a good engineer listens to all advice and evaluates it to see how feasible an idea is.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First and foremost, with any project, the very first thing to consider is... can I afford to embark on this journey? If the answer is NO, keep reading. If the answer is YES, keep reading.

BUDGET

To begin, I will be documenting this from the point of a person who has the capabilities and resources to perform a full automotive restoration job in the comfort of their own home garage. So, if you are reading this thread, more than likely you immediately know that this will single handedly be the most EXPENSIVE modification that can be done to this platform (with the exception of going AWD, but it's in the same realm).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

:::SPECS:::

ENGINE
TRANSMISSION

REAR
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Old 07-29-2015, 04:01 PM   #2
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Chassis Evaluation

To begin, out of the options for the CB chassis (coupe, sedan, and wagon), I'm not sure at this point which one is the easiest to start with. However, they all will follow the same format as far as fabrication. In the world of handling performance and stability, well, I'm only going to perform the necessary calculations for the coupe (the dimensions are somewhat very similar). The concepts used for the front of the vehicle will be the same for all chassis. It's only in the rear where it'll differ. However, I'm sure anyone attempting this will be able to find solutions to the changes in the rear.

In reality, a 50/50 weight distribution is optimal. Being honest, we're taking a FWD car and adding weight to the middle and back (transmission, drive shaft, and rear differential) of it that was never present before. The weight distribution, at this point, I have no idea where it'll end up.

Furthermore, we're going to try and avoid any unnecessary cutting to the chassis if possible. This means using as much of Honda chassis engineering team's (circa 1986) creation as possible. Ideally if we can use existing suspension mounting points (a stretch, but it maybe possible) the car may be just a tad bit more rigid when we finish. We have to do some evaluation to see if this will be the case though. Also, chassis stiffening for torsion is a must. This car was never engineered to twist in the longitudinal direction. Also, trying to keep the original front spindle setup minus the drive shafts is an idea that seems like it'll help in the time department. Using the existing rack or some custom rack would be great. These are all things that need to be evaluated.

- Coupe

- Sedan

- Wagon
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Last edited by Straight Success; 07-29-2015 at 08:34 PM.
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Old 07-29-2015, 04:02 PM   #3
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Engine Selection / Rear Differential

This should not have to be mentioned, but I will try not to leave any aspects unaddressed. When choosing an engine for this project, it is best to choose an engine out a car that was originally RWD. Can you use an engine that was never design for a RWD application? Yes, but it would make the project that much more difficult, expensive, and time consuming. The engine/transmission options for a project of this magnitude vary greatly, so it is wise to plan and choose Accordingly! , Sorry I had to. Realistic options range from inline 4s, 5s, and 6s, to V6s and 8's. .

It should be clear to see that the smaller inline options, at least at first glance, may be an easier option to swap in simply attributable to spatial constraints. However, the planning here will be done from one of the most extreme cases; a V8. This will also allow to engineer the most extreme case which, in theory, should work without additional evaluation in the less extreme cases.

Rear Subframe Options To Investigate:

- Corvette (C4/C5/C6) - by popular demand.
- Mazda Miata
- Nissan 240SX/300Z/300ZX
- Honda S2000
- BMW E30/E36
- Mercedes Benz C Class
- Lexus IS250
- Toyota SC300
- Audi A4/TT
- Other
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Last edited by Straight Success; 07-29-2015 at 08:29 PM.
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Old 07-29-2015, 04:02 PM   #4
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Chassis Strengthening / Engineering Analysis

Initial Known Variables ('92-'93) [using unverified data for now]:

Length (Coupe/Sedan) : 4704 mm (185.2 in.)
.... ......(Wagon) : 4745 mm (186.6 in.)

Width (Coupe/Sedan) : 1704 mm (67.1 in.)
.... ......(Wagon) : 1714 mm (67.5 in.)

Height (Coupe/Sedan) : 1326 mm (52.2 in.)
.... ......(Wagon) : 1351 mm (53.2 in.)

Wheelbase (All models) : 2720 mm (107.1 in.)

Curb Weight (All models) : 1237 kg (2728 lbs.)

Fluid Capacities

I need the naked sprung and unsprung weight.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm thinking once I get the car completely stripped, I can evaluate it better. Esentially, I will design the entire interior space in Catia V5 and apply various loasd to the structure in the form of real world predictability. It will not be certain, but it will give me a good idea where the weak points would be to inform me of where to properly brace. I'm thinking going with a tube structure that would transfer the various forces evenly throughout the tube structure. I also would like to incorporate the tube structure so that the original interior pieces can go back together without noticing the additions.
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Old 07-29-2015, 04:03 PM   #5
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Sourcing

Reserved 4.
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Old 07-29-2015, 04:03 PM   #6
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Fabrication

Reserved 5.
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Old 08-17-2015, 05:28 PM   #7
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This is definitely a project that I'm trying to see through to the end.
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Old 08-17-2015, 06:33 PM   #8
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Quote:
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This is definitely a project that I'm trying to see through to the end.
You better, I'm tired of seeing all these projects go to the wind and not a single person actually have a running RWD CB7
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Old 08-17-2015, 08:34 PM   #9
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You better, I'm tired of seeing all these projects go to the wind and not a single person actually have a running RWD CB7
I have the knowledge and skill.

Currently I don't have the resources. As soon as I get those, you'll have a prized RWB CB7. I'm currently trying to get settled in a new place, and as soon as I do, this is one of my main focuses.
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Old 08-20-2015, 02:43 AM   #10
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Okay, so I have a line on enough affordable garage space to pull this off.

Now, is there any volunteers out here in SoCAL who could help assist me with completely stripping a CB coupe down to its bare ass?
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Old 08-20-2015, 02:48 AM   #11
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I have my eye on this!

As soon as I get a job, I'll pick it or another like it up. The quest will continue.
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Old 12-27-2015, 11:22 PM   #12
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Next step, full schedule for this project.

Most likely the schedule will be tentative as certain factor will change over the course of the project.

I'm ball parking about $17,000, and that includes complete drivetrain, custom pieces sourced from industry, and misc. expenses and money for error.

A good LS1 package with transmission and rear is about $6,000-$8,000 or so. An LT1 option would be significantly less. Ballpark around $2,000-$4,000.
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Old 12-28-2015, 08:58 AM   #13
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Surely there are enough junkyards in SoCal that you can find at least one decent LS (or the Ford 302 that's so popular with Miata V8 swaps?) and rebuild for hundreds rather than thousands?

In regards to that AWD Civic above, there have been several AWD and RWD Civic, CRX, and Integra builds using CRV and S2000 parts. I remember seeing a very nicely done RWD F20C swap in a DC2.
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Old 01-05-2016, 02:30 AM   #14
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Okay, is there anyone in the Los Angeles area who's willing to lend a hand with the complete tear down of a black '93 Accord EX coupe and '94 Chevy Caprice (just the drive train/and ECU system run everything: engine/transmission/drive shaft/entire rear).

I can provide food/water/beer if you like/and garage space (roughly 1000 sq. ft.) I will be keeping all parts, so I plan to keep this very organized.

Yes, I'm aware I will need a custom drive shaft and other components.


Were going automatic people, but no column shift.
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Old 01-05-2016, 06:18 PM   #15
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Do you have a schedule in mind? If you dont mind help from a novice, I'd be happy to help. I'm just waiting on parts before sending the engine out to be worked on. So I have some free time.
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Old 08-20-2015, 03:19 AM   #16
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not to stray it to off topic but there is a guy in reno that did an AWD civic with CRV parts i believe. what about that?

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Old 08-20-2015, 03:38 AM   #17
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not to stray it to off topic but there is a guy in reno that did an AWD civic with CRV parts i believe. what about that?[/youtube]
Anything is possible with enough time, money, and resources.

I think I'll have some time now to do a build looking ahead, I'm networking to gain additional resources, and the money, well...

Since I don't have a full shop to do custom builds at my disposal, this will be an in-house style build. They typically take longer and more patience.
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Old 08-20-2015, 03:47 AM   #18
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Anything is possible with enough time, money, and resources.

I think I'll have some time now to do a build looking ahead, I'm networking to gain additional resources, and the money, well...

Since I don't have a full shop to do custom builds at my disposal, this will be an in-house style build. They typically take longer and more patience.
oh i hear ya. im looking into buying a shed to use as a motor shop so i can tear down an H22
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