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Old 11-09-2018, 12:25 AM   #1
BreckAConner
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Motor Viberate in a sine pattern

To start with what I did before this problem happened I'll explain the story.

Day before the heavy vibration:

I drove 2 hours out and drug home a CB with the RA. Van was fine, no problems.


Day of the heavy vibration:

This morning, drove to work back and forth between the buildings I work at, no problems, van was normal besides saw that coolant was leaking from the heater core hose.

Before I went home I drove to my mother business and had a snack then got in the van decided to have a little fun and slid around a little in the parking lot while the asphalt was wet. (may be the cause?)

When I started to get on the highway I noticed the heavy consistent vibration (with revs/RPMs) all the way home. (note this didn't happen in the morning)

After I got home I pulled the van in the garage to replace the heater core hose, fix my oil leak from the dizzy and put new brake pads on. (none of this would affect the problem above, or shouldn't)

My cousin noticed in the rear right strut, one of the nuts was gone on top inside the van, and the strut was starting to come loose. Put a new nut on tightened them down. (may be the cause?)

Then a few hours later hopped in the van to take my girl home to get her clothes and such, the vibration is no longer consistent but now is pulsating in and out like a sine wave. It's like a perfect sine wave, not inconsistent. (very very annoying rather have the consistent vibration)

When I got home, I checked timing marks and the balance shafts are in time. I loosened all the motor mounts (ESP Mounts) and re-tightened them down, even gave the exhaust a few kicks to see maybe if it was up against something causing the vibration. Took it for a test drive, problem still exists.

This vibration problem happens all the time, the van is in neutral at a stop. The higher the throttle is held, the quicker the vibration sine happens. It's not CV shafts, or suspension because the car is not moving. So could it be motor mounts just shifted around or settling in, or is it possible for balancing to go bad in the motor?

I couldn't find anything related to what I have on google, all I found is your motor mounts are bad, or balance shafts aren't set correctly, but both are good. New mounts, timing hasn't changed. I'm at a loss, any suggestions?
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Old 11-09-2018, 10:11 AM   #2
sonikaccord
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Based on the consistency, I would say balance shafts too.

It would have to be something in time/sync with the engine RPM. Flywheel? Clutch plate?

What happens when the clutch pedal is depressed and engine revved?
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Old 11-09-2018, 12:49 PM   #3
BreckAConner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sonikaccord View Post
Based on the consistency, I would say balance shafts too.

It would have to be something in time/sync with the engine RPM. Flywheel? Clutch plate?

What happens when the clutch pedal is depressed and engine revved?
It doesn't matter if I'm in gear or neutral, or the clutch is in or out, it's all the same. I don't think the right side balance shaft can come loose inside the cover but I'm wondering if it could be that? Only other thing I was thinking is the motor is sitting up against something. It's the weirdest thing ever.

*Edit*

Driving around today, the vibration seems to be coming from mostly the driver side of the vehicle. I was thinking as well maybe it could some of these things which I know doesn't make sense.

The CV Half shaft carrying vibration to the CV Shaft to the knuckle and you get the rest

or the radius bar bolt popped out or bad bushing causing vibration through that.

But like I said, the vibration is all the time, it's not in gear or when moving, it's happening all the time.

I'm going to check this stuff when I get home, but just a thought.

Last edited by BreckAConner; 11-09-2018 at 03:07 PM.
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Old 11-09-2018, 09:33 PM   #4
BreckAConner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sonikaccord View Post
Based on the consistency, I would say balance shafts too.

It would have to be something in time/sync with the engine RPM. Flywheel? Clutch plate?

What happens when the clutch pedal is depressed and engine revved?
You nailed it sonikaccord.







I checked the timing marks like said, and they were lined up so I don't know how it would spin perfectly back in to place, but when I took the belt off I could freely spin the balance shaft gear. Now I got to figure out if it's safe to put the other one on. It's got a bit of play not that it's got that gouge in the shaft where it lines up.

I really don't want to put a new balance shaft in. That means having to pull the motor.
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Old 11-09-2018, 09:43 PM   #5
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So run without the balance shaft belt and call it a day.
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Old 11-09-2018, 09:48 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpys93 View Post
So run without the balance shaft belt and call it a day.
👍
Plus you will get more power
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Old 11-09-2018, 10:12 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpys93 View Post
So run without the balance shaft belt and call it a day.
Indeed. Put the cover back on and move on!
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- 1993 Accord LX - White sedan (sold)
- 1993 Accord EX - White sedan (wrecked)
- 1991 Accord EX - White sedan (sold)
- 1990 Accord EX - Grey sedan (sold)
- 1993 Accord EX - White sedan (sold)
- 1992 Accord EX - White coupe (sold)
- 1993 Accord EX - Grey coupe (stolen)
- 1993 Accord SE - Gold coupe (sold)
Current cars:
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- 2004 Chevrolet Express AWD - Camper conversion
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Old 11-10-2018, 11:56 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cp[mike] View Post
Indeed. Put the cover back on and move on!
I mean that is the future plan, is more power for the van. I have 2 questions though.

If I put it back on, do you think it's safe enough with that little play in the notch?

If I don't put it back on, how much of a gain am I really getting, It can't be much?
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Old 11-10-2018, 12:17 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BreckAConner View Post
I mean that is the future plan, is more power for the van. I have 2 questions though.

If I put it back on, do you think it's safe enough with that little play in the notch?

If I don't put it back on, how much of a gain am I really getting, It can't be much?
No, I don't think the notch is safe. That is on the driven side where all of the torque gets transferred to. Even with a new gear I would personally still worry about it moving around, or breaking loose in the future. But that's just my opinion... And unfortunately the shaft can't be replaced without lifting the motor up out of the bay to make room, so the one you have is staying there. You have a new gear on hand, and I'm guessing it feels like it fits pretty snug even with the chunk missing from the shaft? I'd still skip it, and I'll explain why:

The point really isnt about gaining any significant amount power, so much as leaving it off doesnt harm reliability, and only helps power conservation rather than hurt it. Civics and most other brands don't even have balance shafts - so the difference in comfort will be very negligible, especially once the harmonics are evened out, rather than vibrating in and out in an uncomfortable wave pattern. If this were my car, I would be thrilled to finally know the source of the weird issue and knowing that it is something irrelevant to the functionality of the car, and is something free and easy to bypass! Solve it by literally just taking a belt off, and gain power in the process? In terms of car problems, that's a score!
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- 1993 Accord LX - White sedan (sold)
- 1993 Accord EX - White sedan (wrecked)
- 1991 Accord EX - White sedan (sold)
- 1990 Accord EX - Grey sedan (sold)
- 1993 Accord EX - White sedan (sold)
- 1992 Accord EX - White coupe (sold)
- 1993 Accord EX - Grey coupe (stolen)
- 1993 Accord SE - Gold coupe (sold)
Current cars:
- 2005 Subaru Legacy GT Wagon - Daily driver
- 2004 Chevrolet Express AWD - Camper conversion

Last edited by cp[mike]; 11-10-2018 at 12:22 PM.
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Old 11-10-2018, 12:20 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BreckAConner View Post
I mean that is the future plan, is more power for the van. I have 2 questions though.

If I put it back on, do you think it's safe enough with that little play in the notch?

If I don't put it back on, how much of a gain am I really getting, It can't be much?
Overtime that little play will turn into more play....due to the vibration.

As for more power, your butt dyno May feel a little. No one has dynoed with or without the balance shaft. But common sense and engineering states that if you take a load off something it will spin more easily. By removing the belt, the crank can spin more freely and put that motion else were and free up power. If I was to guess I would say probably 2-5hp. It will also bump up your oil pressure a tad.

Edit: Mike beat me to the punch. But the balance shafts like he stated are for comfort as the accord was designed for more comfort then the civic.
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Last edited by Grumpys93; 11-10-2018 at 12:22 PM.
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Old 11-10-2018, 06:25 PM   #11
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That white cb I am trying to give away ( hint hint anyone) does not have one on it and I cant really tell
the rear shaft actually has gears that reverse its direction and they spin at 2x your engine speed
why would you want your motor to drive that for what ?
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Green EX http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=176536
Frost White Ex http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=189517
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Old 11-10-2018, 08:07 PM   #12
BreckAConner
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Thanks guys for all your input! I left the belt off, it vibrates a little more, but not as bad as it was with the balance shafts being on and off balance, and the sine wave vibration is no longer a problem.

Once again thank all of you for the input, I hope this helps anyone in the future!
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Old 11-13-2018, 03:43 PM   #13
BreckAConner
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For future reference if I or someone else needs a kit to delete balance shafts.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fro...t+kit&_sacat=0
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