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Lost crankshaft pulley. Motor will still turn over. Possible damage?

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    Lost crankshaft pulley. Motor will still turn over. Possible damage?

    I picked up this '91 LX yesterday. The PO says the crank pulley flew off on him (I'm guessing he didn't torque down the bolt enough). He did have the old pulley and the splines on the pulley look great, so I'm confident the crank itself is not damaged.

    The way I understand it, the valvetrain is tied to crankshaft motion via the timing belt, which rides on a splined pulley down on the crankshaft. This pulley appears to be intact and still mounted from what I can see through the timing cover hole where the crankshaft pulley once was. I'm unable to see how smooth the engine's rotation is since the crankshaft bolt is gone, and the battery is dead so I can't crank it that way.

    How likely is it that my engine may have incurred damage? How might you all test for that?
    Last edited by wtfisafleek; 09-03-2017, 05:06 PM.
    My '91 LX build. Bought September 2017. Sold June 2020.
    http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...r /> t=209871
    Current mileage: 399450 5/18/2020

    My '92 LX build. Bought Novemeber 2019. http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...91#post3293791
    Current mileage: 422679 11/21/19

    #2
    As long as the timing belt hasn't broken or jumped more than a tooth or two, internal damage probably isn't an issue. Not from this, anyway. Other neglect may have occurred.
    Get a good battery and crank it. Do a compression test. If compression is good, then I'd trust there's no damage. Hopefully you can extract the old bolt(if it broke and left a chunk inside), then replace it and the pulley.






    Comment


      #3
      That's great news, thanks for the input. The PO told me the battery may have had a bad cell per Autozone, but when I hooked it up it was putting out some juice.

      I've got it on the trickle charger now. It didn't immediately indicate the battery was bad, so fingers crossed I'll be able to test electrical things later tonight.

      I don't want to try cranking it until I can get a new pulley/woodruff on there. Man I can't do anything until I get these parts - so agonizing.
      My '91 LX build. Bought September 2017. Sold June 2020.
      http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...r /> t=209871
      Current mileage: 399450 5/18/2020

      My '92 LX build. Bought Novemeber 2019. http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...91#post3293791
      Current mileage: 422679 11/21/19

      Comment


        #4
        Running the car without the pulley can throw off the crankshaft balance and can damage your crank.

        Personally I wouldn't be touching the car until I'd installed a new pulley.

        But the effects are minimal. Its just that I wouldn't do it. Its probably fine.
        sold! But here's my build thread for those interested.

        http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=206864

        Comment


          #5
          I'm going to check for error codes as soon as I get the battery charged up. I'm not going to run it, but I will crank it over just to see if there's any bad sounds.
          My '91 LX build. Bought September 2017. Sold June 2020.
          http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...r /> t=209871
          Current mileage: 399450 5/18/2020

          My '92 LX build. Bought Novemeber 2019. http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...91#post3293791
          Current mileage: 422679 11/21/19

          Comment


            #6
            All error codes will have been cleared with the dead battery.
            Cranking to do a compression test probably wouldn't do any damage. But I do agree that trying to run the engine without the pulley would indeed cause damage. Hopefully the previous owner wouldn't have run the engine much without the pulley (I guarantee that's how the battery died...)






            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by deevergote View Post
              All error codes will have been cleared with the dead battery.
              Hopefully the previous owner wouldn't have run the engine much without the pulley (I guarantee that's how the battery died...)
              Good points. It's definitely getting new belts all around before I do anything. Got everything on order, including the update bracket to hold that one seal behind the timing cover in.
              My '91 LX build. Bought September 2017. Sold June 2020.
              http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...r /> t=209871
              Current mileage: 399450 5/18/2020

              My '92 LX build. Bought Novemeber 2019. http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...91#post3293791
              Current mileage: 422679 11/21/19

              Comment


                #8
                After more reading I see it's not a good idea to even bump the motor over with the starter if there's a chance of piston/valve interference. So I'm thinking I'll need to install my new pulley/key when I get them just to give the crank a couple spins and check for binding. Does that sound reasonable to you guys?

                I did get a chance to get the timing covers off, it appears a seal or two was leaking so I'll have to address that. I did get the valve cover gasket kit yesterday, though it's got some gaskets I can't identify after looking at parts diagrams. At https://www.hondapartsnow.com/parts-...ead-cover.html I think they're listed as:

                12342-PT0-000
                Gasket B, Head Cover

                If I'm correct, where do these even go? I'll add a pic later if it's not clear what I'm asking about.
                My '91 LX build. Bought September 2017. Sold June 2020.
                http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...r /> t=209871
                Current mileage: 399450 5/18/2020

                My '92 LX build. Bought Novemeber 2019. http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...91#post3293791
                Current mileage: 422679 11/21/19

                Comment


                  #9
                  Spark plug tube gasket. They are located under the rocker arm assembly.

                  YouTube Clicky!!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Update:
                    I got my new crank pulley in the mail and started to attempt putting it on in an attempt to set the motor to TDC. But as I got to looking around, the cam/crank pulley seems to have spun. Understandable since the key was gone to prevent it from doing so.
                    The keyways for the crank and the pulley are of by about 120 degrees or so. That said, I wanted to to see if I could take the pulley off, get the cam pulley turned to orient with the crank, set the new pulley off and fast it down enough to spin it and check for interference.
                    However when I go to start the new crank bolt, it just doesn't want to catch. I'm not sure, but it appears the old bolt may have snapped inside!! I'm willing to bet this is a hardened bolt and that I may just cut my losses and get another motor.
                    What do you all think?


                    Last edited by wtfisafleek; 10-29-2017, 12:42 PM.
                    My '91 LX build. Bought September 2017. Sold June 2020.
                    http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...r /> t=209871
                    Current mileage: 399450 5/18/2020

                    My '92 LX build. Bought Novemeber 2019. http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...91#post3293791
                    Current mileage: 422679 11/21/19

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Being around nuts and bolts all the time, I'd honestly try to drill it out and extract the bolt.
                      Start off with an extractor. If that doesn't work you can use a drill bit large enough (a millimeter or two smaller than the shaft of the bolt) and you can actually remove most of the bolt and just clean the threads out with a tap.
                      Easier said than done, I know... but what's the worst you can do? Break it?! If that fails you're still in the same boat...

                      EDIT:
                      Oh and if that fails, you can always try to weld something to it and wrench it out... but being a crank bolt I doubt this method would work.
                      Last edited by Jon; 09-08-2017, 09:35 PM.
                      Click Image for CB7Tuner.com Beanies, Decals, & Keychains!

                      Comment


                        #12
                        I just read your username!
                        I thought the same thing when I first heard that.

                        Anyway, what I would do is try to spin it out by tapping a screwdriver or a chisel-like tool on the edges. Maybe it'll work enough to get some vice grips on it?

                        YouTube Clicky!!

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Jon View Post
                          Being around nuts and bolts all the time, I'd honestly try to drill it out and extract the bolt.
                          Start off with an extractor. If that doesn't work you can use a drill bit large enough (a millimeter or two smaller than the shaft of the bolt) and you can actually remove most of the bolt and just clean the threads out with a tap.
                          Easier said than done, I know... but what's the worst you can do? Break it?! If that fails you're still in the same boat...

                          EDIT:
                          Oh and if that fails, you can always try to weld something to it and wrench it out... but being a crank bolt I doubt this method would work.
                          Jon,
                          I'm leery drilling it out given the last experience I had with these cheap ass drill bits I got. If it's hardened, these sorry things won't barely make a dent in it. But it's worth a shot if it will save me the money of buying another motor.

                          Sonik,
                          I doubt that method too, but I will give it a shot. I've never gotten out such a large fastener doing that, especially one that's torqued down so strongly.
                          My '91 LX build. Bought September 2017. Sold June 2020.
                          http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...r /> t=209871
                          Current mileage: 399450 5/18/2020

                          My '92 LX build. Bought Novemeber 2019. http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthre...91#post3293791
                          Current mileage: 422679 11/21/19

                          Comment


                            #14
                            That's the good thing about a sheared off bolt. There is nothing to "torque" down. Unless the threads are rusted, dirty, or just have a lot of friction, it should spin somewhat easily.

                            YouTube Clicky!!

                            Comment


                              #15
                              ^Yep.
                              That bolt is no longer torqued (Force x Distance), but the threads are probably still under tension (stretch/elongation of bolt providing clamping pressure).
                              So it may be difficult to extract... or not... just have to give it a try and find out. Sometimes a bolt like that will pop out easier than you think.
                              Last edited by Jon; 09-09-2017, 11:59 AM. Reason: spelling
                              Click Image for CB7Tuner.com Beanies, Decals, & Keychains!

                              Comment

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