npor: 2006 C6 Corvette

[Dirty Harry]

Don't forget, in the CB era Accords, the transmissions were fundamentally the same, with just the added parts to make it an automatic.

I gotta call you out on this one. Break open the cases of both trans types and then tell me if you still believe what you just said.

While it theoretically is possible to simply add parts to make a manual gearbox shift automatically, it really doesn't make any sense from any standpoint.

Think about it...for example, manuals have a layshaft, shift forks, synchronizers and the clutch, while automatics have planetary gearset(s), clutch bands/packs and a torque converter.

Cock/balls vs. pussy/tits

[AccordWarrior]

I gotta call you out on this one. Break open the cases of both trans types and then tell me if you still believe what you just said.

While it theoretically is possible to simply add parts to make a manual gearbox shift automatically, it really doesn't make any sense from any standpoint.

Think about it...for example, manuals have a layshaft, shift forks, synchronizers and the clutch, while automatics have planetary gearset(s), clutch bands/packs and a torque converter.

Cock/balls vs. pussy/tits

Hmm, I swear I read something there about it being based off the manual transmissions.

Here's a link I saw posted about Accord automatic transmissions failing in the newer models. This is the line that I was curious about.

http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/sh...t=transmission

In a syncromesh manual trans (which is what cars marketed today are equipped with) all you ratios are in constant mesh fixed on one shaft while freewheeling on the other. Gear selection is accomplished by locking the freewheeling gear of the desired ratio to the shaft it’s spinning on and voila! Your output is served. The make the transition between ratios smoother (as the different ratio gears are obviously turning at different speeds for a given shaft speed) clutch-like devices, known as "syncros" accel &/or decel gears in adjacent ratio pairs before the locks (dog clutches) engage.

Compared to your conventional epicyclical/planetary gear set automatic transmission, ratio selection is far easier, selection more positive and transmission design less complex for ratio addition. In view of this (and the fact that this conclusion had already been arrived at in racing circles, Honda devised and implemented a means of automating gear selection of their manual transmissions instead of lamely following convention. Their efforts yielded the hydraulically actuated manual transmission found in all their AT equipped vehicles.

"How did they achieve automation?" you may ask. Simple. By replacing the brass syncros with wet clutches, all they had to worry about was the ratio itself because clutch pack actuation was already a mastered technology.

The quirk to this transmission was that it had very positive shifts a consequence of wet clutches. Considered more of a boon than a nuisance to race teams, commuters found the shift quality rather alienating, especially since their previous exposure to AT's was limited to the forever-slipping-into-this-ratio-or-that conventional AT.

I dunno, I just found it interesting.

[Dirty Harry]

Hmm, I swear I read something there about it being based off the manual transmissions.

Here's a link I saw posted about Accord automatic transmissions failing in the newer models. This is the line that I was curious about.

http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/sh...t=transmission



I dunno, I just found it interesting.

That really is interesting, and I'll tell you what, I didn't know that before. I never cared enough about automatics to research any proprietary technologies, just the standards. When I said I thought it was impractical to add parts to a manual to make it automatic, that's what I meant... purely adding parts, not this interesting design you just showed me.

Good info, I stand corrected.

[owequitit]

It's Soy, he's always right. :sarcasm:

I agree on the manumatic stuff. Don't forget though with Ferrari, those gated shifters are a bitch to shift, which certainly lends itsself to the sales figures.

The problem with a lot of automatics, at least in a non-performance car is they will shift early.

My mom's auto Accord actually surprised me in how strong it was compared to my manual...it will bang right into the redline. Don't forget, in the CB era Accords, the transmissions were fundamentally the same, with just the added parts to make it an automatic.

If I remember right, the 98 Supra was 0-60 in 5.0 seconds for the autobox and 4.9 seconds for the manual.

The automatic wouldn't be faster in the curves, but could win in a straight line if the driver of the manual wasn't good.

It all depends on the car.

LOL! I agree, those shift gates are antiquated, and make no sense, but it isn't a small difference either. The F1's are quite a bit quicker in some cases. It also helps that it is truly a sequntial manual, in that it has a dry plate clutch that engages and disengages, and not a torque converter.

Much like Audi's DSG, which is even better, in that one of the two clutches is always engaged, so there is ALWAYS power delivery.

Honda is notorious for early shifting auto trannies, although oddly, mine used to shift no higher than 5800, and now with the stuff I have done, it shifts at 6300 like it should. I wonder if there is some kind of soft logic in there. It wouldn't surprise me.

Anyway, generally manuals have been accepted to be faster, but like I said that is getting blurry and yes, it does depend on the car.

Autos have always been capable in a straight line race, which is why autos are so common in drag racing. The potential loss for a misshift far outweighed the additional drivetrain loss of an auto.

[owequitit]

there is absolutly no comparison when it comes to control during a road race. You cannot begin to compare unless you spead of SMG transmissions. Accord warrior you have issues, get off my back

You are right. That is why the fastest road racing cars in the world use SMGs. Like Ferrari's F1 gearbox (coincidentally where they developed the technology and got the name).

[owequitit]

Hmm, I swear I read something there about it being based off the manual transmissions.

Here's a link I saw posted about Accord automatic transmissions failing in the newer models. This is the line that I was curious about.

http://www.driveaccord.net/forums/sh...t=transmission



I dunno, I just found it interesting.

That was interesting. And it does explain why they have traditionally shifted so "firmly". Personally, I prefer it. I forget which supplement it was that Helms publishes for the CB7, but it goes into all the power flows and how it works etc. They really are a different animal. Of course, Honda always has marched to the beat of a different drum.

Ironically, they have gone a degree back towards this firm shift quality. I keep contrasting my CB, my mom's old CG, and her new CM. I hate to sound like a broken record, but it is just such a noticable pathway, I can't help it.

The CB was firm, sometimes maybe when it shouldn't be. The CG was always soft. On upshift, kickdown etc. It was setup the way autos were "expected" to be.

With the CM they have compromised. It is butter smooth under most conditions, sometimes even imperceptible, but the shift firmness increases in direct relation to your aggression on the pedal. If you stomp it, it WILL bang gears down and then back up, and there is no hesitation like on the CB, and to an even greater extent the CG. Let back off, and it goes right back to smooth as butter.

[npor]

How much did you pay for it?

i think MSRP with all the options it's got on it..it runs like...$55,000-60,000

we got it for around $47,000

[accordtypeR]

nice step bro....

[accordtypeR]

An Auto?

Come on man... nice car though

Sure its a sports car but dont get it twisted by the auto tranny its hauls ass. I know because I drove one...

[npor]

eh, i woke up and figured i'd snap a few shots.


they're in the first post

bye

[accordtypeR]

Nice new pics mang. Im loving the engine shot...

[npor]

thanks man

[npor]

nope. you read it right, HUD.

[koolkoreanked]

I dont know why most of everyone is knocking the auto. The auto tranny that GM uses in the vette is nasty. Maybe not so in the corner but the auto tranny runs neck and neck with the 6 speed and is much easier to drive around town. The Corvette/TransAM/Camaro/GTO/CTS-V are some of the few I would take as an auto.

And I hate autos.

[Dom]

HUD!! thats badass!!