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Old 02-12-2017, 02:30 PM   #1
GTRON
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Question Repairing rust with Fiberglass?

Has anyone successfully repaired CB7 rust with fiberglass, and had it last?
I've seen one dude do it on here, and it seemed to work well for him. My rust is getting worse fast, and I really want to fix it.
I want to do it right, and I want it to last, but I can't do metal repair.

Thanks!
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"A stock 25 year old F22A is about as likely to be "fine" under ANY amount of boost as your 85 year old grandma is to be "fine" while running a marathon at ANY speed." -Deev


^100 years old^
(but she runs a 100 meter dash, not a marathon! 26.2 miles would most likely kill her. -deev)

(I stand corrected )

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Old 02-12-2017, 03:46 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTRON View Post
Has anyone successfully repaired CB7 rust with fiberglass, and had it last?
I've seen one dude do it on here, and it seemed to work well for him. My rust is getting worse fast, and I really want to fix it.
I want to do it right, and I want it to last, but I can't do metal repair.

Thanks!
If you want to do it right and you want it to last, you need to do metal repair.

Anything else is a temporary fix. The rust WILL return.
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Old 02-12-2017, 03:57 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AccordWarrior View Post
If you want to do it right and you want it to last, you need to do metal repair.

Anything else is a temporary fix. The rust WILL return.
Did you repair yours? Or did you get a shop to do it?

Some people will debate that fiberglass repair does work, if done right.
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"A stock 25 year old F22A is about as likely to be "fine" under ANY amount of boost as your 85 year old grandma is to be "fine" while running a marathon at ANY speed." -Deev


^100 years old^
(but she runs a 100 meter dash, not a marathon! 26.2 miles would most likely kill her. -deev)

(I stand corrected )

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Old 02-12-2017, 04:22 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTRON View Post
Did you repair yours? Or did you get a shop to do it?

Some people will debate that fiberglass repair does work, if done right.
Had a shop do mine.

People can debate all they want, but the fact is metal is the correct way to repair these cars. Fiberglass is a band aid repair. The rust you can't see is 10x worse than the rust you can. You can patch it up and make it look pretty but until you cut away all the bad metal and expose everything underneath, it will come back and get worse.

I'd sell the car before I'd fiberglass it. If you want a temporary repair that will look good for 6-12 months if it doesn't see road salt, fiberglass will work. However, you're asking how to do it right, which is repairing it with new metal.

To give you an idea...







To rebuild my car took replacement quarter panels and custom built inner wheelhouses.

Prior to purchase of my car in 2001, the rust had been "repaired" by a bodyshop and the car looked decently presentable. Those photos were taken in 2005.
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Old 02-12-2017, 05:18 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AccordWarrior View Post
Had a shop do mine.

People can debate all they want, but the fact is metal is the correct way to repair these cars. Fiberglass is a band aid repair. The rust you can't see is 10x worse than the rust you can. You can patch it up and make it look pretty but until you cut away all the bad metal and expose everything underneath, it will come back and get worse.

I'd sell the car before I'd fiberglass it. If you want a temporary repair that will look good for 6-12 months if it doesn't see road salt, fiberglass will work. However, you're asking how to do it right, which is repairing it with new metal.

To give you an idea...







To rebuild my car took replacement quarter panels and custom built inner wheelhouses.

Prior to purchase of my car in 2001, the rust had been "repaired" by a bodyshop and the car looked decently presentable. Those photos were taken in 2005.
Oh wow. How much did you pay? Mine isn't that bad, yet...
__________________
"A stock 25 year old F22A is about as likely to be "fine" under ANY amount of boost as your 85 year old grandma is to be "fine" while running a marathon at ANY speed." -Deev


^100 years old^
(but she runs a 100 meter dash, not a marathon! 26.2 miles would most likely kill her. -deev)

(I stand corrected )

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Old 02-12-2017, 06:28 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by GTRON View Post
Oh wow. How much did you pay? Mine isn't that bad, yet...
$2,500 back in 2005 for the labor. It was about $300 for the panels (a crazy EBay find way back when), $40 from the junkyard for a 92-93 trunk lid and then $100 or so for the spoiler and about $175 for the red/clears. So that's probably what, $3,000 or so total 12 years ago.

The car came out perfect though.
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Old 02-12-2017, 07:10 PM   #7
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You may have seen this already, but more of what AccordWarrior is talking about: http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=180806

The quarter skins and wheel house panels are no longer available from Honda. I found a rust free shell as a donor. Even with doing what I (and the body shop owner) was the right way, she is starting to bubble at the top of the wheel arches again. The most vulnerable area was the way I had to separate the donor quarter skins from the wheel housing by cutting through the quarter skin. I used adhesive to put this area back together, but the sharp edges of the holes created lots of opportunity for rust to get started again (I do drive it in Ohio winters) even if the lip was covered in undercoating.
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Old 02-12-2017, 08:12 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fleetw00d View Post
You may have seen this already, but more of what AccordWarrior is talking about: http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=180806

The quarter skins and wheel house panels are no longer available from Honda. I found a rust free shell as a donor. Even with doing what I (and the body shop owner) was the right way, she is starting to bubble at the top of the wheel arches again. The most vulnerable area was the way I had to separate the donor quarter skins from the wheel housing by cutting through the quarter skin. I used adhesive to put this area back together, but the sharp edges of the holes created lots of opportunity for rust to get started again (I do drive it in Ohio winters) even if the lip was covered in undercoating.
Do you oil spray / Fluid Film?

I covered my car in FF / oil post repair. I did the same on my Tavona's frame and have had great luck.
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Old 02-12-2017, 10:31 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AccordWarrior View Post
Do you oil spray / Fluid Film?

I covered my car in FF / oil post repair. I did the same on my Tavona's frame and have had great luck.
Amen Mike, I wish I knew about fluid film 10+ years ago. I absolutely love fluid film, it preserves even raw steel and it halts existing rust, as long as the rust is not blocked by paint/undercoating. It really allows you to see what's going on with the metal vs being totally clad/covered with undercoating. Even 1 little tiny void in the undercoating, water goes in, you can't tell and rust grows under the undercoating. That is why I do not like undercoating, you really have no idea what's going on underneath it in regards to rust. Same goes with the seam sealer on our cars, in the rear wheel wells I always find rust growing under the sealer. The metal needs to breathe and not be covered up with a bunch of stuff. Sorry to go OT but I'm just so tired of seeing all the New England vehicles getting eaten alive by rust and most just turn a blind eye to it as rust rapidly forms under paint, undercoating and seam sealer.
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Old 02-13-2017, 09:21 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AccordWarrior View Post
$2,500 back in 2005 for the labor. It was about $300 for the panels (a crazy EBay find way back when), $40 from the junkyard for a 92-93 trunk lid and then $100 or so for the spoiler and about $175 for the red/clears. So that's probably what, $3,000 or so total 12 years ago.

The car came out perfect though.
Oh wow. that's a lot. I couldn't justify putting in that kind of money into my car.

Mine is probably getting close to the passenger side picture, my drivers side is just starting to rust.

Edit: Was that including paint too? Your car definitely came out looking great. For my car I just want rust repaired.
__________________
"A stock 25 year old F22A is about as likely to be "fine" under ANY amount of boost as your 85 year old grandma is to be "fine" while running a marathon at ANY speed." -Deev


^100 years old^
(but she runs a 100 meter dash, not a marathon! 26.2 miles would most likely kill her. -deev)

(I stand corrected )


Last edited by GTRON; 02-13-2017 at 12:01 PM.
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Old 02-13-2017, 09:34 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fleetw00d View Post
You may have seen this already, but more of what AccordWarrior is talking about: http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=180806

The quarter skins and wheel house panels are no longer available from Honda. I found a rust free shell as a donor. Even with doing what I (and the body shop owner) was the right way, she is starting to bubble at the top of the wheel arches again. The most vulnerable area was the way I had to separate the donor quarter skins from the wheel housing by cutting through the quarter skin. I used adhesive to put this area back together, but the sharp edges of the holes created lots of opportunity for rust to get started again (I do drive it in Ohio winters) even if the lip was covered in undercoating.
Wow, you had rust come back on yours?! That's not cool, after all the work you've put in.
__________________
"A stock 25 year old F22A is about as likely to be "fine" under ANY amount of boost as your 85 year old grandma is to be "fine" while running a marathon at ANY speed." -Deev


^100 years old^
(but she runs a 100 meter dash, not a marathon! 26.2 miles would most likely kill her. -deev)

(I stand corrected )

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Old 02-13-2017, 12:29 PM   #12
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Here's some pics of my rust

Drivers side, both rust spots weren't there a year ago...



Passenger side, the bad side. No rust on top of the wheel well (Inside) from what I could tell...



Passenger side facing the back bumper, the bumper clip (Idk what it's called) is all rusted out, I could pretty much pull the whole corner off...



Passenger side, back door jam.

__________________
"A stock 25 year old F22A is about as likely to be "fine" under ANY amount of boost as your 85 year old grandma is to be "fine" while running a marathon at ANY speed." -Deev


^100 years old^
(but she runs a 100 meter dash, not a marathon! 26.2 miles would most likely kill her. -deev)

(I stand corrected )

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Old 02-13-2017, 06:14 PM   #13
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I would have to agree that repairing with metal is the best fix, but as someone who has used fiberglass as a patch I feel maybe I should chime in with my experiences.

First off, fiberglass will only fix so much. Know how big of an area you are fixing before you decide how to fix it. If you have a hole that's 1"x1", plan on cutting away at very least 4"x4" of metal. The rust underneath the paint and behind and inside and all throughout, all the stuff you can't see, is a way bigger mess than what you can see. Once you start grinding, you'll see what I'm talking about.

Second, Don't plan on using fiberglass to repair areas that provide structural integrity. This should be obvious, but you'd be surprised.I patched my car above the lift points in front of the rear tires, and had I needed to remove any more metal it would've been a waste of time. I feel that what I did was good enough and didn't mess with any integrity. Just to be sure, I put my car on a lift and none of the fiberglass cracked. Then I jacked it up, no cracking.

Third, buy more fiberglass then you ever intend on using. Once your car starts rusting where you can visually see it, you're going to find even more when you start removing bumpers and side skirts. Once my rear bumper was off, I could see that the entire rear of my car is basically beyond repair. When I say beyond repair, I mean beyond reasonable repair for the cost/value. That's why I chose fiberglass. Had I spent the money to "do it right" I never would've seen a return on my investment. If you're not fixing your baby, and the car is just to get you from point a to point b while passing your local state inspection, then fiberglass is a great cost saving option to avoid having to look at an eyesore everyday.

Also- prep, as in any body work, is key. I used a grinder to remove as much rust and thin metal as possible. Then I treated the exposed metal with a rust treatment that converted anything I missed to a paintable surface (product claims). Then applied the fiberglass (I use Bondoglass, I have used resin and cloth and find it's more brittle in my opinion). I shape the fiberglass the best I can and add more as need it. Then I brush over everything with more rust treatment just to touch on anything I may have scuffed when I sanded the fiberglass. Once all is cured you can prime, paint, clear. If you don't live in the salt belt you'll get a year or more out of your work, but it's better than visible rust and you saved a ton of money. Again, don't expect a beautiful finished product or a long lasting finish. It is what it is.

Here's some pics of my Vigor and it's extensive cancer. I don't have any "finished" pics because it's the dead of winter right now and I haven't been able to finish the job. But so far, the rust has not returned and I've been driving on salted roads for months now and the metal is exposed other than having a coating of rust treatment covering it. Coating is key!





Basically Everything under the green fiberglass had to be cut completely out and the fiberglass was used to make an entire panel... It was sanded smooth and coating with bed liner after this picture.



And one shot for good measure!

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Old 02-13-2017, 10:16 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vermonter View Post
I would have to agree that repairing with metal is the best fix, but as someone who has used fiberglass as a patch I feel maybe I should chime in with my experiences.

First off, fiberglass will only fix so much. Know how big of an area you are fixing before you decide how to fix it. If you have a hole that's 1"x1", plan on cutting away at very least 4"x4" of metal. The rust underneath the paint and behind and inside and all throughout, all the stuff you can't see, is a way bigger mess than what you can see. Once you start grinding, you'll see what I'm talking about.

Second, Don't plan on using fiberglass to repair areas that provide structural integrity. This should be obvious, but you'd be surprised.I patched my car above the lift points in front of the rear tires, and had I needed to remove any more metal it would've been a waste of time. I feel that what I did was good enough and didn't mess with any integrity. Just to be sure, I put my car on a lift and none of the fiberglass cracked. Then I jacked it up, no cracking.

Third, buy more fiberglass then you ever intend on using. Once your car starts rusting where you can visually see it, you're going to find even more when you start removing bumpers and side skirts. Once my rear bumper was off, I could see that the entire rear of my car is basically beyond repair. When I say beyond repair, I mean beyond reasonable repair for the cost/value. That's why I chose fiberglass. Had I spent the money to "do it right" I never would've seen a return on my investment. If you're not fixing your baby, and the car is just to get you from point a to point b while passing your local state inspection, then fiberglass is a great cost saving option to avoid having to look at an eyesore everyday.

Also- prep, as in any body work, is key. I used a grinder to remove as much rust and thin metal as possible. Then I treated the exposed metal with a rust treatment that converted anything I missed to a paintable surface (product claims). Then applied the fiberglass (I use Bondoglass, I have used resin and cloth and find it's more brittle in my opinion). I shape the fiberglass the best I can and add more as need it. Then I brush over everything with more rust treatment just to touch on anything I may have scuffed when I sanded the fiberglass. Once all is cured you can prime, paint, clear. If you don't live in the salt belt you'll get a year or more out of your work, but it's better than visible rust and you saved a ton of money. Again, don't expect a beautiful finished product or a long lasting finish. It is what it is.

Here's some pics of my Vigor and it's extensive cancer. I don't have any "finished" pics because it's the dead of winter right now and I haven't been able to finish the job. But so far, the rust has not returned and I've been driving on salted roads for months now and the metal is exposed other than having a coating of rust treatment covering it. Coating is key!





Basically Everything under the green fiberglass had to be cut completely out and the fiberglass was used to make an entire panel... It was sanded smooth and coating with bed liner after this picture.



And one shot for good measure!

This is exactly what my thoughts have been on this whole rust deal. The car is worth about $1200, how does it make sense to pay that much (or more) to get rust fixed... I mean it makes sense for some dudes, but not for me at the moment.
Thanks so much for the advice man! I think I'm gonna try fiber-glass for now, at least till I have money to do it "right". I'm trying to buy parts for a 5 speed swap right now! I think doing it right really depends on the quality of the work, I don't see why you can't get rid of rust with fiberglass if you do it right (treating it, sealing it...). Why not try the $50 fix before spending big money on it.
That's a cool ride, I dig the black-housed headlights.
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"A stock 25 year old F22A is about as likely to be "fine" under ANY amount of boost as your 85 year old grandma is to be "fine" while running a marathon at ANY speed." -Deev


^100 years old^
(but she runs a 100 meter dash, not a marathon! 26.2 miles would most likely kill her. -deev)

(I stand corrected )

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Old 02-14-2017, 06:45 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTRON View Post
This is exactly what my thoughts have been on this whole rust deal. The car is worth about $1200, how does it make sense to pay that much (or more) to get rust fixed... I mean it makes sense for some dudes, but not for me at the moment.
Thanks so much for the advice man! I think I'm gonna try fiber-glass for now, at least till I have money to do it "right". I'm trying to buy parts for a 5 speed swap right now! I think doing it right really depends on the quality of the work, I don't see why you can't get rid of rust with fiberglass if you do it right (treating it, sealing it...). Why not try the $50 fix before spending big money on it.
That's a cool ride, I dig the black-housed headlights.
Thanks, they are the OEM JDM Vigor headlights, bumper lights, grill, and window visors.

And I agree a $1,200 car is not worth the money to fix the rust unless you bought the car as a show car project. Building a show car is always a case of throwing buckets of money at your vehicle without any expectation of a return on your investment. A daily driver is a different story. Typically people don't spend absurd amounts of money just to get from point A to point B. My current car is never going to be a show car, but at least I know all my bolt-on parts can be either taken off and sold for a return on my investment, or I can re-use them on another Vigor project when the time comes. Either way, I'm sure my fiberglass repair will last as long as I intend on driving this car.
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Old 02-15-2017, 09:52 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vermonter View Post
Thanks, they are the OEM JDM Vigor headlights, bumper lights, grill, and window visors.

And I agree a $1,200 car is not worth the money to fix the rust unless you bought the car as a show car project. Building a show car is always a case of throwing buckets of money at your vehicle without any expectation of a return on your investment. A daily driver is a different story. Typically people don't spend absurd amounts of money just to get from point A to point B. My current car is never going to be a show car, but at least I know all my bolt-on parts can be either taken off and sold for a return on my investment, or I can re-use them on another Vigor project when the time comes. Either way, I'm sure my fiberglass repair will last as long as I intend on driving this car.
There's no way my car will be a show car, LOL!
But I want have fun with this car, without spending thousands and thousands of dollars on it.
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"A stock 25 year old F22A is about as likely to be "fine" under ANY amount of boost as your 85 year old grandma is to be "fine" while running a marathon at ANY speed." -Deev


^100 years old^
(but she runs a 100 meter dash, not a marathon! 26.2 miles would most likely kill her. -deev)

(I stand corrected )

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Old 02-16-2017, 04:44 PM   #17
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sell it and buy one with less rust

fixed
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Old 02-16-2017, 07:13 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oni_cb7 View Post
sell it and buy one with less rust

fixed
Honestly...this.

You want to swap yours to manual, right?

A plane ticket to AZ would get you a rust free manual for not that much more than you'd probably spend to get yours where you want to be.
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Old 02-17-2017, 09:17 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by AccordWarrior View Post
Honestly...this.

You want to swap yours to manual, right?

A plane ticket to AZ would get you a rust free manual for not that much more than you'd probably spend to get yours where you want to be.
Of course I could always do that haha.
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"A stock 25 year old F22A is about as likely to be "fine" under ANY amount of boost as your 85 year old grandma is to be "fine" while running a marathon at ANY speed." -Deev


^100 years old^
(but she runs a 100 meter dash, not a marathon! 26.2 miles would most likely kill her. -deev)

(I stand corrected )

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Old 03-07-2017, 01:14 PM   #20
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Agreed. I found my car on Craigslist in Las vegas. It was the original owner that started it's life in California and then around 2007 made its way to vegas. Car has zero visible rust but I eventually found some between the rear window and trunk. Got a quote for around 500$ to fix it and then it should be rust free.

Sell car and find one in California
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