transmission fluid flush

[greenquark]

Hi there,

I want to flush the transmission fluid for my honda. I have read a bit about it and I understand I have to do like 3 fill/flush cicles?

Once I do that , how often should I flush/fill the tranny?


Just finished a 3000 km road trip, it did average 32 mpg on the road. I getting overly emotional over my honda, and I want to take good care of it. this little car has never disappointed me.

[XCRN]

A flush is pretty unnecessary unless it is really dirty in there. If it is still fine for the most part a drain and refill like a regular oil change will suffice probably for the life of the car.

[illinois_erik]

the torque converter holds a fair amount..Im partial to this method, do it all in one shot instead of the drain/refill cycle that mixes old with new. Technically you cant do a flush on our transmissions they have an internal filter and a regular quik-lube trans flush would do more damage then not back flushing all the crap back into the inner workings.



also keep your transmission alive with regular service intervals and id suggest an inline transmission filter that you can service.

use whatever brand you want, you just want a magnetic one regardless.

http://www.emergingent.com/magnefine...ation_page.htm

[greenquark]

A flush is pretty unnecessary unless it is really dirty in there. If it is still fine for the most part a drain and refill like a regular oil change will suffice probably for the life of the car.

This is what my uncle said:"do not do anything to the transmission fluid, it will last for the life of the car". I didn't believe him and I did the 3 cycle flush like 5 years ago. everything was fine.

I wanted to do it again just for the sake of it.

I checked the transmission fluid color, and it is not pink/red but it is not dark brown...

I am colorblind though...:/

I am confused

[XCRN]

I am not saying to never service it, I am saying after you flush it once, a simple fluid change (drain and refill) at regular intervals will keep it running. You probably will not have to do the "3 cycles" again for the life of the car.

[greenquark]

I am not saying to never service it, I am saying after you flush it once, a simple fluid change (drain and refill) at regular intervals will keep it running. You probably will not have to do the "3 cycles" again for the life of the car.

Oh, I understand...But the last time i did it was a while ago. My question is : Should I do the 3 time cycle and the service it ( flush/fill once) every oil change or every other oil change?

I really appreciate your input

Cheers

[XCRN]

I do not think it would hurt to do the flush, but whether or not it is necessary to do the 3 cycles, I do not think so by the sounds of it the car is working great. The service manual says to change the fluid every 36,000 miles.

[johnl]

Oh, I understand...But the last time i did it was a while ago. My question is : Should I do the 3 time cycle and the service it ( flush/fill once) every oil change or every other oil change?

IMO if the fluid was changed at least reasonably recently (3 X change after a period of unknown service), then it probably doesn't need a further 3 X change. With automatic gearboxes I do like to 'change' the fluid once at every second engine oil change. If you have a 10,000km engine oil change interval then this means you effectively have a (close to) full transmission fluid change every 60,000km. Can't hurt...

[greenquark]

IMO if the fluid was changed at least reasonably recently (3 X change after a period of unknown service), then it probably doesn't need a further 3 X change. With automatic gearboxes I do like to 'change' the fluid once at every second engine oil change. If you have a 10,000km engine oil change interval then this means you effectively have a (close to) full transmission fluid change every 60,000km. Can't hurt...

Oh no, I change oil every 3500 miles , I checked my logs, and the last time I did the transmission fluid flush (3 times) was 30 000 miles ago , BUT it was in 2007

When I read the manual it says etiher X miles or Y months , whatever comes first

So, still my questions is: Should I do 1 flush( flush and refill ) or the 3 cycle thingy?

My other question is I put , Honda ATF-Z1 in the last service, now honda only has DW-1 fluid . Can I use the DW-1 for a flush/fill of the old ATF-Z1? or it is necessary the 3 time flush, in order to replace the ATF-Z1 with the new DW-1 fluid?

[johnl]

Oh no, I change oil every 3500 miles ,

I admire your diligence, but do think your oil change interval is unnecessarily short. Personally I'd be happy to do it every 5000 miles, which is still a relatively short change interval.

I checked my logs, and the last time I did the transmission fluid flush (3 times) was 30 000 miles ago , BUT it was in 2007

When I read the manual it says etiher X miles or Y months , whatever comes first

So, still my questions is: Should I do 1 flush( flush and refill ) or the 3 cycle thingy?

I can't see why time spent sitting in the transmission doing nothing will have any adverse affect on the fluid (same for engine oil). I ignore such time related recommendations (others may disagree), though less so for brake fluid where the fluid can absorb at least some moisture over an extended period of just sitting there (but then brake fluid is hygroscopic, whereas oils aren't). Time is also a consideration for coolant.

At 30,000 miles your transmission fluid is still relatively young, personally I wouldn't be at all concerned about it. But, I would still be considering changing the fluid (once) at the next oil change. Given your frequent engine oil interval I'd modify my recommendation to transmission fluid every third engine oil change. It's still probably overkill, but the Honda fluid isn't all that expensive and it's good preventative maintenance.

My other question is I put , Honda ATF-Z1 in the last service, now honda only has DW-1 fluid . Can I use the DW-1 for a flush/fill of the old ATF-Z1? or it is necessary the 3 time flush, in order to replace the ATF-Z1 with the new DW-1 fluid?

My understanding is that the newer Honda trannie fluid supersedes the earlier fluid, and is 'reverse recommended' for the older transmissions. Don't take my word for it though, check.

[greenquark]

Thank you for your throughout reply!

I do it every 3500 because I don;t drive too much this car. I use for long drives camping/road trips. I don;t even drive it during winter. So all in all, it sums up to twice a year.

Ok when I put my car in storage during winter, I changed the oil just right before. I usually change the oil 4 months later, when I take it out of storage. The oil/filter were just sitting there. Is that necessary?

Since it is not expensive for me, I do it...But I wonder if the oil acidification is an issue while the car is in storage.

[johnl]

I do it every 3500 because I don;t drive too much this car. I use for long drives camping/road trips. I don;t even drive it during winter. So all in all, it sums up to twice a year.

Your car has a very easy life!

Ok when I put my car in storage during winter, I changed the oil just right before. I usually change the oil 4 months later, when I take it out of storage. The oil/filter were just sitting there. Is that necessary?

No. The cold won't hurt the oil or filter, nor IMO will the time spent doing nothing. The biggest issue for engines that have been sitting for a long period of time with no running is that the oil can drain away from the moving parts. So, it's good practice to crank the engine over on the starter with the spark plugs removed (until the pressure light goes out). This (cranking with the plugs removed and allowing oil to circulate without the engine actually starting) reduces 'dry' loadings on the bearings when you do start the engine, and some oil should also squirt onto the cylinder walls.

Even so, the amount of damage that might be caused by not doing this is unlikely to be very significant (at least some oil will remain where it needs to be), but it certainly won't hurt to go through this process. Additional insurance (reassurance?) might be had by taking the cam cover off and pouring a bit of oil onto the cam lobes as these may be a bit 'dry'. However, in my experience there is usually some oil between the lobes and follower faces even after the engine has been sitting for quite some time.

Since it is not expensive for me, I do it...But I wonder if the oil acidification is an issue while the car is in storage.

My understanding is that oil acidification is the result of the oil being contaminated by by-products of combustion. It's my understanding that this is a process that will stop when the chemicals causing the acidification already in the oil are 'used up', i.e. there are no longer any of these chemicals present in the oil because they have all been consumed in the acidification process.

I'm not sure if this is simply a matter of the combustion by-products being acidic (which many of them are) and that they are added in use, i.e. simply adding their acidity to the PH of the oil, or whether it's a catalytic process (or it might be both?). Either way it's my understanding that if you stop adding 'new' contaminants then the process will cease. But, I'm not a chemical engineer, so I could be wrong...

What is I think something of an issue is leaving already very contaminated (i.e. acidic) oil in the crankcase for a long period of time, as the acidity could cause damage in that period. Heat will make this worse, so it's possibly more of an issue for an engine that is still being used than one that is in 'hibernation'...

With this in mind I think it's good practice for the engine oil to be changed prior to storing the car, but in that case I don't think there is any need to replace the oil when you take it out of storage.

PS, acidification isn't an issue for transmission fluid since the fluid isn't exposed to contaminants in the same way as engine oil is. It's degraded by becoming dirty due to products of wear becoming suspended in the fluid, i.e. molecules of friction material and metals (and possibly degraded rubber from aged external hoses?). Same deal for power steering fluid.

[greenquark]

Easier life than that since the storage is in a climate control building parking lot .

what I do when I take it out in April is the following:

1. I plug the battery back
2. I insert the key and pump the pedal one or twice, I open the switch but not start the car wait for 10 seconds, do it agian and then I start the car. I have been doing that for the last 6 years.

I didn't hear any of What you are telling me with no sparkplugs and it makes very much sense.

Could you explain taht in details? Just take off the sparkplugs cables and try to start the car? how many seconds , how many times?

[johnl]

2. I insert the key and pump the pedal one or twice, I open the switch but not start the car wait for 10 seconds, do it agian and then I start the car. I have been doing that for the last 6 years.

Well that won't hurt, but then again it won't do anything. All you're doing is opening and closing the butterfly valve in the throttle body. No fuel will inject unless the engine is cranking over. No oil will circulate until the crank is rotating and the oil pump is pumping.

With a carburettored engine, pumping the throttle a couple of times before cranking will squirt some petrol into the manifold (assuming there is actually any petrol in the float chamber, which there may not be if the engine hasn't been started in a long time), which can help start the engine, but does nothing with fuel injection.

I didn't hear any of What you are telling me with no sparkplugs and it makes very much sense.

Could you explain taht in details? Just take off the sparkplugs cables and try to start the car? how many seconds , how many times?

Just take the plugs out, fit each plug to it's lead, rest the plugs against the engine in order to earth them, and crank the engine over until the oil pressure warning light goes out, done. Refit the plugs and fire up the engine, but don't rev it for a minute or so in order to make sure plenty of oil gets to the top of the engine to lubricate the cam lobes, and for oil to get sprayed upward into the cylinder bores.

It's good practice to earth the plugs against the motor so that the electrical energy can do some work (i.e. make sparks), rather than have 'nowhere to go' other than 'backing up' in the ignition system. It's extremely unlikely that not doing this would in fact cause any damage to the ignition system, but if you earth the plugs the likelihood goes from extremely low to zero.

[Vladi]

Never heard of flushing multiple times in a row, I think a gearbox has a greater benefit in doing a flush, driving 1000 miles and flush it again.

And always use OEM Honda oil, theyre just the best for Honda gearboxes.