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Delta Regrinds & ECU questions

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    Delta Regrinds & ECU questions

    I have some experience with this issue, but I had many more intake, head and exhaust modifications in addition to the basic setup I describe below. Thus, I HAD to run a chipped P06 ECU initially to even run my engine, the stock PT3 ECU would fall flat on its face because it ran too rich.

    These questions have nothing to do with my projects, simply my curiosity. So PLEASE don't relate this to my projects.

    Setup:

    - Stock engine OR Stock engine with intake, header, exhaust modifications.


    My questions:

    1) Installing just a Delta 260 cam regrind with either setup described above, was a chipped ECU or Hondata system necessary?

    2) Installing just a Delta 272 cam regrind with either setup described above, was a chipped ECU or Hondata system necessary?


    Please answer if you have personal experience with this. I want to have a better idea on when an upgraded ECU is necessary out of curiosity. Thanks.
    Last edited by HondaFan81; 09-29-2006, 04:13 PM.
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    #2
    I dont have experience with that setup, but it is necessary. It needs to be tuned plain and simple in order for you to take full advantage of the upgrades. Ad an adjustable camgear and you can adjust that powerband.

    You already know that if you dont tune your engine with a chipped ecu then you wont see as much improvement with your I/E/H as you would if it was tuned.

    It all comes down to it being tuned in order for it to run 100%.

    i wouldnt waste my money on hondata.
    H22 Prelude VTEC 92-96 200 161 10.6:1 87 90 DOHC VTEC 2157 JDM

    190.3whp 155 wtq - with bolt ons, and a dc header

    ET=14.457 @ 94mph w/ 2.173 60Fter

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by phatdoughnut
      I dont have experience with that setup, but it is necessary. It needs to be tuned plain and simple in order for you to take full advantage of the upgrades. Ad an adjustable camgear and you can adjust that powerband.

      You already know that if you dont tune your engine with a chipped ecu then you wont see as much improvement with your I/E/H as you would if it was tuned.

      It all comes down to it being tuned in order for it to run 100%.

      i wouldnt waste my money on hondata.
      It's obvious to me that a chipped ECU would more than likely help out once you add a camshaft upgrade.

      My questions remain though, for each the 260 and 272 can a basically stock engine (with atmost I/H/E) RUN of a stock ECU?

      EDIT: Hondata systems are more reliable in my opinion and it was less of a headache for me, not as time consuming once I located a dyno shop 15 minutes from my work.
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        #4
        yea, we all know that a tuned ecu is best.

        he's just asking if the stock ecu can actually run the car with either of those cams.

        I dont think anyone has actually installed any of those cams and NOT gotten a chipped ecu. well, none that I know of.

        as far as the engine management goes, its all personal preference. If you find it better for you to spend more money than to not pay money and deal with the issues crome and uberdata bring up, then w/e. uberdata and crome takes LOTS of time and playing around with to get it running the way you want.

        CrzyTuning now offering port services

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          #5
          the closest experience i ahve is with a SOHC vtec civic engine, where we locked the vtec lobes all the time. it would run, very roughly and uber rich at idle but often died at random.
          once i did some minor tuning with Crome and later Hondata it ran a hell of a lot better.


          and you already know that i feel the same as you about hondata vs crome/gooberdata.

          Comment


            #6
            i think it would be like running a stock f22 ecu on an h22 vs the p13. It would run, but run like shit.
            H22 Prelude VTEC 92-96 200 161 10.6:1 87 90 DOHC VTEC 2157 JDM

            190.3whp 155 wtq - with bolt ons, and a dc header

            ET=14.457 @ 94mph w/ 2.173 60Fter

            Comment


              #7
              Well, my setup isn't even close to that, but had a similar experience...


              I was tuned @ 8 psi, ran good, smooth, maybe a blip or two randomly while driving, but pretty rare.

              Then installed my delta 260's

              Had alot more blips, part throttle driving was real doggy, then it would pickup and just scream, then lean out and misfire in boost.

              Like I said, similar situation, but not really.

              Hope this helps.

              L8r
              Turbo H23a3 build has begun
              01-01-2019

              Comment


                #8
                i have the f22b dohc, with 272 just installed on it and the problem we had was the rough idle and that the car was leaning out at 6k so definately you need to run a po6 for it. 272 pull lika mother and the idle is perfect at 1000 but if if you have any other questions pm me, or check my members ride thread.


                SOLD-->10-09-06


                MY 2000 PROTEGE

                MY OLD CB7

                THE SWAP

                MY COROLLA TYPE-S

                Comment


                  #9
                  of course. you cant expect to run your car with an unchipperd po6 . well you could if you want to blow youn engine


                  SOLD-->10-09-06


                  MY 2000 PROTEGE

                  MY OLD CB7

                  THE SWAP

                  MY COROLLA TYPE-S

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by bjaccord
                    Well, my setup isn't even close to that, but had a similar experience...


                    I was tuned @ 8 psi, ran good, smooth, maybe a blip or two randomly while driving, but pretty rare.

                    Then installed my delta 260's

                    Had alot more blips, part throttle driving was real doggy, then it would pickup and just scream, then lean out and misfire in boost.

                    Like I said, similar situation, but not really.

                    Hope this helps.

                    L8r
                    Were these conditions you had running a stock ECU with your 8 psi boost setup? If so, which specific stock ECU did you use? Also, was there additional piggyback engine management in addition to the stock ECU, etc? You didn't mention any of this, I'm curious.

                    Hmm, after re-reading it seems you were "tuned" like you said, implying you had some chipped ECU w/tuning, but adding the Delta 260 obviously would cause for a retune. Perhaps in stock form it holds to be the same circumstance.

                    Reason I ask is because if you talk to Delta, they almost imply that a 260 regrind can be put on a I/H/E F22ax engine like a bolt-up with no engine management tweaking needed, but a 272 perhaps not. I just want to know the real-world answer on this. I think they imply to get a FPR to bump up the fuel and get by this route.
                    Last edited by HondaFan81; 10-03-2006, 10:23 AM.
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                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by yeamans17
                      so you've got the p06 but is it chipped and tuned?
                      it has to be as a stock P06 is for a 92-95 civic with a 1.5L engine nonvtec SOHC
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                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by chicohonda91
                        i have the f22b dohc, with 272 just installed on it and the problem we had was the rough idle and that the car was leaning out at 6k so definately you need to run a po6 for it. 272 pull lika mother and the idle is perfect at 1000 but if if you have any other questions pm me, or check my members ride thread.
                        Okay, I figured the consensus on the 272 was chipped P06 after my personal experience. So let's leave that question alone now.

                        Any takes on the Delta 260 cam regrind, can it be run on stock ECU on F22ax motor with ATMOST I/H/E for mods??
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                          #13
                          Yea I am on a chipped ecu.

                          The 260's definantly messed up a few things. Driveability was pretty poor and the responsivness of the motor was bad as well.

                          IMO someone with I/H/E and 260's should look into a chipped ecu and atleast an hour of tuning.

                          While your in there you might as well put an adjustable cam gear on, you'd be tuning anyway so ehh.

                          Just my thoughts.

                          L8r
                          Turbo H23a3 build has begun
                          01-01-2019

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by bjaccord
                            Yea I am on a chipped ecu.

                            The 260's definantly messed up a few things. Driveability was pretty poor and the responsivness of the motor was bad as well.

                            IMO someone with I/H/E and 260's should look into a chipped ecu and atleast an hour of tuning.

                            While your in there you might as well put an adjustable cam gear on, you'd be tuning anyway so ehh.

                            Just my thoughts.

                            L8r
                            I see your point. However, based on my personal experience with a Delta 272 on my red Accord project, I saw that 0 degree cam timing was the best setting and my head was resurfaced .010". Even the dyno tuner said that on non-VTEC SOHC cammed Honda motors that if your head is not milled or slightly (like my .010") you will not see much change adjusting your cam timing. I adjusted my cam timing +2 and -2 deg on the dyno, I have the graphs to prove it.

                            So unless you're milling above .010", I say use your stock cam gear and don't spend the money on an adjustable one.
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                            Comment


                              #15
                              Sounds good.

                              I don't have alot of experience with the ol' Sohc motor (Mines been gone for nearly 6 years now) so that kind of info is best from those who are experimenting with it.

                              Hopefully someone will post up with some sohc 260/delta info, and what if any tuning they did.

                              Good luck with the research. L8r
                              Turbo H23a3 build has begun
                              01-01-2019

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