CB7Tuner Forums

Go Back   CB7Tuner Forums > Beginner forum -- New members post here! > Beginner Technical/Performance

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 11-14-2017, 09:26 AM   #1
Scallopini
Newcomer
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3
Scallopini is cool... so far.
H22A improper valve adjustment noise/concerns/issues

Motor is a JDM H22 with unknown mileage. Bought it running in a 93 Accord. Runs on a Phearable chipped P28. Always ran strong and had great throttle response. I/H/E, stock longblock. Weather started getting colder and valves started chattering. My mechanic told me to leave it alone until itís time to rebuild the head. I became impatient and tried to perform a valve adjustment. Iím not a certified mechanic by any means but know my way around Hondaís. Apparently I donít... I used the proper feeler gauges but did an improper valve adjustment. Started it up and it sounded like sheet metal falling over on the ground, if that makes any sense. Definitely a metal on metal kind of ticking. I left it running for a minute but never let it warm up. I noticed that after 30 seconds or so, the sound would go away, then come back. I went through it again and checked clearances, same thing. Had my mechanic come over to do it properly. He told me it was way out on every valve. Some were tight and some were loose. After he was done, we threw on the valve cover and fired it up. That same metal on metal noise was still there but a little noticeable this time around. The motor ran 10x better with better response and exhaust note. However, at the same time, the idle was stumbling and very lopey. Was running rich too. After it warmed up, that sound would go away and then come back upon startup. No CELs or anything like that. We checked inside the motor to make sure nothing dropped in there when I did the adjustment previously. It stalled out once or twice on a test drive. My mechanic told me he didnít think any valves got bent. He thinks one of the cams, if not both, got scored up because of my job. Doesnít sound like a bent valve but some of the symptoms are present apparently. Besides a leak down or compression test, would it be beneficial to throw in a set of spare H22 cams to see if that is the issue? He almost thought it coming from the timing belt/alternator area. It definitely is a scratchy metal on metal and not valve chatter. Any ideas/thoughts/concerns? Iím also using Valvoline 5w30 full synthetic. Never any issues before this.
Scallopini is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2017, 12:47 PM   #2
Bunta
CB7tuner Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Texas,Arizona and Massachusetts
Posts: 150
Bunta is cool... so far.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scallopini View Post
Motor is a JDM H22 with unknown mileage. Bought it running in a 93 Accord. Runs on a Phearable chipped P28. Always ran strong and had great throttle response. I/H/E, stock longblock. Weather started getting colder and valves started chattering. My mechanic told me to leave it alone until itís time to rebuild the head. I became impatient and tried to perform a valve adjustment. Iím not a certified mechanic by any means but know my way around Hondaís. Apparently I donít... I used the proper feeler gauges but did an improper valve adjustment. Started it up and it sounded like sheet metal falling over on the ground, if that makes any sense. Definitely a metal on metal kind of ticking. I left it running for a minute but never let it warm up. I noticed that after 30 seconds or so, the sound would go away, then come back. I went through it again and checked clearances, same thing. Had my mechanic come over to do it properly. He told me it was way out on every valve. Some were tight and some were loose. After he was done, we threw on the valve cover and fired it up. That same metal on metal noise was still there but a little noticeable this time around. The motor ran 10x better with better response and exhaust note. However, at the same time, the idle was stumbling and very lopey. Was running rich too. After it warmed up, that sound would go away and then come back upon startup. No CELs or anything like that. We checked inside the motor to make sure nothing dropped in there when I did the adjustment previously. It stalled out once or twice on a test drive. My mechanic told me he didnít think any valves got bent. He thinks one of the cams, if not both, got scored up because of my job. Doesnít sound like a bent valve but some of the symptoms are present apparently. Besides a leak down or compression test, would it be beneficial to throw in a set of spare H22 cams to see if that is the issue? He almost thought it coming from the timing belt/alternator area. It definitely is a scratchy metal on metal and not valve chatter. Any ideas/thoughts/concerns? Iím also using Valvoline 5w30 full synthetic. Never any issues before this.
When doing a valvejob the head does have to be heated to roughly 70 degrees, so if you didn't do this that is part of your problem right there. Part of what can happen when doing the adjustment itself is that when setting the clearance you can slightly turn the nut that hold everything in place and that will throw the measurement off. You should be able to see or feel if your cams are scored, if not then I think switching cams would be an unnecessary effort. Does it go away with the engine fully warmed up (not just the coolant temp ) but the engine fully hot?
Bunta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2017, 01:52 PM   #3
Scallopini
Newcomer
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3
Scallopini is cool... so far.
The adjustments were all done with motor cold. Sat overnight the first couple of times. The noise is present on startup and while itís warming up (coolant temp). Oddly enough, it goes away when the motor is fully hot. My mechanic and I went out and drove it normally and the noise never came back. Then, this AM I had my wife fire it up while I was in front of it and the noise was back. Was more intermittent, not as intense. My mechanic keeps saying the lobes will smooth themselves oh if they got scored. In other words, it wasnít running long enough to do extensive damage. Anything is possible though with motors. Whatís even more odd is that the throttle response, power, and VTEC is different, in a good way. Everything smoothed out. He told me everything sounds normal except for that noise weíre talking about. I HIGHLY doubt anything fell in there because we both agreed it wouldíve been toast while on a test drive.
Scallopini is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2017, 07:26 PM   #4
Raf99
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 2,737
Raf99 is very helpful Raf99 is very helpful
So what you have here is simply worn parts. I mean, it was chattery to begin with (once it started getting cold out). So the noise was going to be present no matter what. Maybe even worsen with the cold or due to old age. I think your mistake may have contributed to this, but at the same time your mechanic improved the situation too.

So you are left with this sound in the head, and you'll never know if it was old age/cold and/or your work which contributed. It may have been going this route even if you didn't touch it is my point.

You may have scored them but that wouldn't cause the sound your describing. I hear this sound from my engine too sometimes. It's just that the parts of the head are old.......
Raf99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2017, 11:52 PM   #5
Bunta
CB7tuner Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Texas,Arizona and Massachusetts
Posts: 150
Bunta is cool... so far.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scallopini View Post
The adjustments were all done with motor cold. Sat overnight the first couple of times. The noise is present on startup and while itís warming up (coolant temp). Oddly enough, it goes away when the motor is fully hot. My mechanic and I went out and drove it normally and the noise never came back. Then, this AM I had my wife fire it up while I was in front of it and the noise was back. Was more intermittent, not as intense. My mechanic keeps saying the lobes will smooth themselves oh if they got scored. In other words, it wasnít running long enough to do extensive damage. Anything is possible though with motors. Whatís even more odd is that the throttle response, power, and VTEC is different, in a good way. Everything smoothed out. He told me everything sounds normal except for that noise weíre talking about. I HIGHLY doubt anything fell in there because we both agreed it wouldíve been toast while on a test drive.
So it does sound like your tolerances are a bit loose and as everything heats up and parts expand you are in the correct range. The reason why it (the head) has to be warm is because you are setting very precise clearances that have to account for thermal expansion of the metals. The exhaust side has a looser initial clearance because it gets hotter and expands more. I'm getting a bit of valvetrain noise myself but being that it is winter I am waiting until things warm up before tackling it.
Bunta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2017, 04:26 PM   #6
92smokeaccord
CB7tuner Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: north branford ct
Posts: 2,164
92smokeaccord seems to have made some friends! 92smokeaccord seems to have made some friends!
So I'm gonna ask did you have to use good amount force to unlock the adjuster nut?

If so here's what actually happened. You used the force from unlocking the nut and bent the valve at the top... happened to me with mine. When you Loosin or tighten the adjuster nut you are torquing the rocker arm in the same direction. So now the top is bent and when the car is running the valve spins and catches the lip of the slot for the valve top valve seat and slams back into place.
__________________

my new turbo build
92smokeaccord is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:29 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.