Hello.. f22a1 cb7 owner.. boosting?

[dblockcb7]

Whats up everyone, im kind of new to the forums but i lurk around here often, just never post, i just read all of the DIY threads and get ideas from some cars on this site, its been very informative!

ever since i bought my CB7 i been going through the great debate of h22a swap or boost my f22a1.. i googled this subject so much that i learned a little from each and some benefits.

I love the all motor aspect, thats why i was highly leaning towards the h22, i figure, it'd make a nice daily, 200hp is my goal, and the swap is bolt on for the most part, from my understanding.

Then again, i read about keeping the f22, saving some money, and boosting on the stock block with no more then 5-8 PSI to keep me at my 200hp range, i read about guys boosting 10 PSI and they're hitting the 250+ range, which is way more then i need for the time being, i was going to peice together a turbo with the help of homemadeturbo forums and slowly replace old parts of my f22 with newer parts, doing all the nice maintenance things and taking my sweet time babying the motor using it as the daily.

honestly i think the f22 boosted would be the best option, for a long term build, i dont plan to bang out the build in months, cus im not balling out of control, but slowly fix it up, peice this turbo together, find good sources for tuning, and ride the SOHC.

later on i would look into replacing rods and pistons just for reliablility sakes, the motor is on 230k right now, its pretty darn healthy in my opinion, i never beat on it but who knows what the previous owner did.

sorry for my rambling but i didnt want to just post the usual nooby question with out giving you details, motor health, goals and etc before i get chewed out

recap:

230k stock motor, pretty healthy, maintainance kept up really well, replaced about 40% of parts from water pumps to belts to gaskets since i got it, still replacing stuff.

Goals are around 200 whp but im willing to start off a little low, say 5psi to just drive it daily, i got some friends who tune so i can work something out with the tuning, and costs.

i really like the f22a1 so dont just say swap, lol thanks guys and awesome forum!!

[southsidecb7z]

So....what is your question?

[Ander]

DSM turbo parts will, with little modification, bolt right up.
Here's that parts you would need.

14b Turbo Charger
DSM Turbo Manifold
DSM o2 Housing
DSM 450cc Injectors
Chipped P06 ECU
Front Mount Intercooler
1st Gen DSM Blow Off Valve
Charge pipe Kit
Oil Feed and Return kit

[dblockcb7]

DSM turbo parts will, with little modification, bolt right up.
Here's that parts you would need.

14b Turbo Charger
DSM Turbo Manifold
DSM o2 Housing
DSM 450cc Injectors
Chipped P06 ECU
Front Mount Intercooler
1st Gen DSM Blow Off Valve
Charge pipe Kit
Oil Feed and Return kit

yeah i read that on the HMT site, this build sounds really exciting!

i guess my question was if im on a boost as low as 5-8 psi im not really doing much damage to the motor, with it being as high as 230k am i?

and if i decided to stay at my 200 whp goal, would upgrading rods/pistons be needed? or could i just buy some fresh f22a1 piston/rods and replace.

[SOHC-FTW]

PSI has nothing to do with it they are so many different turbos out there that no one should ever tell you what psi is safe or not.You can not compare the damage a piss ant can do vs a grizzly bear.
Your horse power goal is what you want to watch for on any build always set your goals.If they aren't achievable time to do some real work.A stock block can only handle so much power&stress before it goes bye bye.Ringlands are the weak point so i would atleast look into some new or better OEM type pistons,Use ARP rod and head studs.For 200whp you shouldn't be worried on a fresh rebuild, but at 230k i'd play it safe an inspect everything in the bottom end.If it needs a minor rebuild so be it.

[dblockcb7]

PSI has nothing to do with it they are so many different turbos out there that no one should ever tell you what psi is safe or not.You can not compare the damage a piss ant can do vs a grizzly bear.
Your horse power goal is what you want to watch for on any build always set your goals.If they aren't achievable time to do some real work.A stock block can only handle so much power&stress before it goes bye bye.Ringlands are the weak point so i would atleast look into some new or better OEM type pistons,Use ARP rod and head studs.For 200whp you shouldn't be worried on a fresh rebuild, but at 230k i'd play it safe an inspect everything in the bottom end.If it needs a minor rebuild so be it.

ok, so forget about psi for now and worry about the goal, gotcha.

Guess i have some inspecting to do, sounds like a little bit of down time while i have the block open though, think i should just buy a block from the local yard here and restart?

im not really worried about the head, it was rebuilt not too long ago, so im saving that for last.

im trying to take my time with this build, so no rush

[deevergote]

5-6psi on a 14b DSM setup should get you in the 190-200whp area with a careful tune. I've known people to do this on high mileage motors.

The F22A's weak point (when all else is done carefully) is the ringlands. You will most definitely crack a ringland even with low boost. It's hard to say how long before this happens. Some run for years, some last months... or weeks... or days.

The BEST option is build before you boost... or buy a spare motor and build that on the side. If you break a ringland and the cylinder wall gets scratched up, you'll need expensive machining (or even more expensive resleeving) to really make it usable again. If you're boosting this motor with plans of building it later, you may end up having to do more rebuilding than expected.


Still, your plan sounds decent. Your goals aren't too lofty, and you seem like someone that is willing to research before diving in... so you should be fine, whatever you do. This site and HMT are VERY good sources for info. Be sure you learn how to tune, or find a good tuner (and at least learn enough yourself about it to be able to determine if the tuner is ACTUALLY good, and not just full of shit...)

[dblockcb7]

5-6psi on a 14b DSM setup should get you in the 190-200whp area with a careful tune. I've known people to do this on high mileage motors.

The F22A's weak point (when all else is done carefully) is the ringlands. You will most definitely crack a ringland even with low boost. It's hard to say how long before this happens. Some run for years, some last months... or weeks... or days.

The BEST option is build before you boost... or buy a spare motor and build that on the side. If you break a ringland and the cylinder wall gets scratched up, you'll need expensive machining (or even more expensive resleeving) to really make it usable again. If you're boosting this motor with plans of building it later, you may end up having to do more rebuilding than expected.


Still, your plan sounds decent. Your goals aren't too lofty, and you seem like someone that is willing to research before diving in... so you should be fine, whatever you do. This site and HMT are VERY good sources for info. Be sure you learn how to tune, or find a good tuner (and at least learn enough yourself about it to be able to determine if the tuner is ACTUALLY good, and not just full of shit...)

thanks for the words, and ill keep that in mind about the ringlands, thats twice ive heard about it so im not even going to risk that chance, its my daily driver

im going to do a bit more research on the bottom end, im thinking about the best piston/rod combo i should go with, i know there are the forged custom ones, i dont want to change the compression because its already almost perfect from my understanding, and i really dont want to fork over almost an h22 for some arias pistons or forged ones lol, could i possibly refurbish some stock f22a pistons/rods and re enforce them some how?

dont get me wrong, im not trying to cheap out but since the piston/rod combo in my motor are already a good set up, and can handle way more then 200whp why change?

[deevergote]

I honestly wouldn't boost your only daily driver.

You can't strengthen stock pistons. They are made of metal that isn't designed to handle boost.

Do it right, or accept the consequences of cutting corners... or, don't do it at all.



Also, keep in mind that even a low boost setup is going to need a clutch upgrade. The added torque will eat your stock clutch very quickly. (I'm assuming you have a manual... if you have an automatic, that's a whole different can of worms...)

[dblockcb7]

I honestly wouldn't boost your only daily driver.

You can't strengthen stock pistons. They are made of metal that isn't designed to handle boost.

Do it right, or accept the consequences of cutting corners... or, don't do it at all.



Also, keep in mind that even a low boost setup is going to need a clutch upgrade. The added torque will eat your stock clutch very quickly. (I'm assuming you have a manual... if you have an automatic, that's a whole different can of worms...)

i feel you, im not trying to cut corners at all, just seeing whats out there, and yeah i have a manual, no auto here hehe

time for some research!

[SOHC-FTW]

I honestly wouldn't boost your only daily driver.

You can't strengthen stock pistons. They are made of metal that isn't designed to handle boost.

Do it right, or accept the consequences of cutting corners... or, don't do it at all.



Also, keep in mind that even a low boost setup is going to need a clutch upgrade. The added torque will eat your stock clutch very quickly. (I'm assuming you have a manual... if you have an automatic, that's a whole different can of worms...)

All of this info is spot on expect one thing that builders and companies use world wide on anything from stock to aftermarket.Shot peening can be used on tons of metals.It helps the over all strength of metals as most cast parts eventually or already have stress cracks.Peening will make the item more durable under greater stress.
There's no need to go overboard and waste 2K+ to build an engine to with stand 200whp.If your going to go with a piston rod combo expect it to be capable of way higher goals.

[deevergote]

You can't shotpeen a ringland, though.

[SOHC-FTW]

You can get the entire piston done.

[dblockcb7]

All of this info is spot on expect one thing that builders and companies use world wide on anything from stock to aftermarket.Shot peening can be used on tons of metals.It helps the over all strength of metals as most cast parts eventually or already have stress cracks.Peening will make the item more durable under greater stress.
There's no need to go overboard and waste 2K+ to build an engine to with stand 200whp.If your going to go with a piston rod combo expect it to be capable of way higher goals.

yeah thats what i thought about last night, i figured if i was staying around my 200 WHP goal, why upgrade? and if i did upgrade, why not go higher lol

so with my goal its safe to say i do not need to upgrade, just rebuild the bottom end slightly, ringlands, bearings, main seals, etc.

gotcha!

[SOHC-FTW]

Im not saying keep it stock but shot peened rods&pistons plus ARP rod bolts&head studs would take 200whp pretty easy and you'd be under $500 for it all give or take.Just remember you could have 15k+ in the engine doesn't mean it will last everything breaks, and with boost you will always won't more power reguardless.I've seen it oh i'm gonna go for 250 month or so later they want more.Also a tune is one of the most important pieces to the puzzle so don't cheap out there!