H22 swap obd1 or obd2?

[mysticskyline]

New to the forums, but not the cb chassis(92 cb9, 90 cb7, 93 cb9, 92 cb9). Looking @ doing a restomod of sorts to my CB9. I am going to install an H22A into it, but am unsure as to whether I should get an obd1 or obd2 equipped engine. OBD1 should be a direct swap, but I am only looking @ M2B4 equipped engines. Not easy to find and I want to buy the 2 connected already/originally. I want the T2W4 equipped Euro Accord R H22A, but know there is quite a bit of work needed in the ecu/wiring harness. Which is the best option?

[4GAccordH22]

As you said, an OBDI engine will be a direct bolt in (with some wiring changes), but an OBDII engine will need to be converted to OBDI with a new distributor and injectors at the very least. Unless you want to convert the car to OBDII, but that's not recommended since it's a TON of work... If you want to go with the Euro R engine, you'll also have to figure out a way to wire up the 4 wire IAV.

[deevergote]

I prefer OBD1 for the ease of swapping, and for the stronger closed-deck block (not that it really matters... but still.) OBD2 is easier to find these days, however.

As for the M2B4, I'd advise against that. Get a standard non-LSD H22A transmission and add an aftermarket LSD. Aftermarket units are superior to OEM units, especially when the OEM units are 15+ years old. Additionally, the OEM units are quite large, and were never sold in the US. Therefore, if one breaks, you cannot easily source parts for them. Aftermarket units will not fit.

The Euro R is arguably the best of the H22A family... but they're so expensive. A cheap one is suspect (especially since there's no way to easily spot a fake, even when you can see it in person.) Expensive ones are just that... expensive. You could get a less expensive H22A and modify it to make nearly as much power as the Euro R (possibly even more power) for the same or less. Additionally, the base H22A (JDM or otherwise) has 100% support in the US for replacement parts. The Euro R has a few things that are not available here. Not many things, and you may never encounter anything you can't easily replace with readily available parts... but it can be a frustration if anything exclusive breaks.

My ideal setup is a base JDM H22A, USDM P13 ECU, M2F4 transmission, Quaife or MFactory LSD.
Add some Delta 272 cams, DC Sports header with a 2.5" collector, Euro R intake manifold, and a well-tuned chipped P28 ECU down the road.

[mysticskyline]

My idea was to do a full JUN autoshop build. I have been watching them for years, and finally feel i am ready to make a move. A few months ago, somebody had a obd1 h22 on ebay with a JUN port & polish, valve springs/retainers, and cams with the m2b4; but no ecu, headers, or axles. Only went for $1025.

[deevergote]

If you're going with a full build, then DEFINITELY get a base H22. You'll be undoing everything that makes a Euro R special, so it'll really just be a waste of money to go that route!

Does JUN still actively support the H22A? I haven't looked into them in a LONG time. That's some serious cash right there, but if they still do the H22A, you'll end up with one hell of an engine, that's for sure!
I wouldn't trust anything on ebay that claims such things, though. Too many fakes out there for my liking. At the very least, don't trust anything that doesn't come with documentation. Even then, it could be sketchy.

[mysticskyline]

I checked into JUN. Their website still claims that they make parts for the H22. My goal is to also stroke the H22 to 2.4-2.6 liters. Not sure who makes the kit for that though. I have only seen 3 or 4 builds that have done it. I have had a few friends tell me to skip the H22 due to age and go full K24, but I don't like i-vtec and I don't feel like spending a fortune on the engine/tranny combo and the work to put it in.

[mysticskyline]

My realistic goal is 400-450 whp that is streetable. Now granted, I will have to turbo as well. This car is in no means a daily driver and never will be.

[deevergote]

That can probably be reached with a stick head, upgraded cam, and a fully built bottom end. Put your money in the bottom end, the turbo, and the tune.

Honestly, the f22a can do that as well. There's no real need for a fairly expensive swap. The f22 transmissions with their longer gears are actually even better for turbo. You can get LSD for those as well.

[Jarrett]

I'm curious as to what it is you don't like about iVTEC. Because of the displacement in factory form, the K24A2 seems to tick all of the boxes for you. I'd usually suggest against it due to cost vs. how cheaply an H22A can be installed in this chassis and then upgraded from there, but this would be cheaper to achieve the same goals. Something tells me that unless you have some sort of racing, dyno queen aspirations for this car, you might be surprised at how comfortable you are in this chassis with 265whp N/A.

[deevergote]

250ish WHP is all I ever wanted from my H22A. More than that I feel would've been a bit unpleasant in a street car. I could see a K series making a bit more (265 seems about right) while remaining similarly forgiving.
With turbo, I wouldn't want more than 300whp, I don't think. Not unless the main purpose was drag racing, and I had it set up to deliver more power at higher gears/speeds. Otherwise, lack of traction would make it more annoying than fun.

The cost of the K series swap has decreased drastically, but it's still more expensive than the H22. The good side to the K is that the aftermarket support is still strong, whereas the H22's support is waning. There are likely more professional builders and tuners familiar with the K than the H as well. The K series is overall the better design. iVTEC a definite advancement. The only thing it lacks is the "kick" that traditional DOHC VTEC engines have at the factory setting... though that "kick" is due to the changeover being programmed a bit late... it was inefficient... it helped sell Preludes and GSRs, though!
When I had my ECU tuned, I left the changeover at the factory RPM. I was happy to sacrifice a bit of performance for the thrill that came with a violent crossover.

[mjsstanley]

I totally agree with both Deev and Jarrett. If you want to turbo the car, I would definitely just stick with the F22 (unless you just really want a swap). You'd be surprised with the amount of power the SOHC motor can make.

Even though you won't be driving the car daily, 400whp probably wouldn't be that fun to drive on the street at all. H22 is an awesome engine, but be ready to spend some serious money to have that make that much power (Turbo or NA) especially wanting to increase the stroke.

On top of what Jarret said, the K24 would be a REALLY good option for you (I'm in the process of starting that swap myself). It's definitely going to cost but I couldn't imagine it being much more than trying to make the same power out of the H22. Cylinders are boost ready, however it's not hard at all to make 300whp NA out of these motors.

[mysticskyline]

After reading comments; especially from deevergote, I am willing to drop my power expectations. My realistic goal for power would be better around 250-275 hp.

My reason for distain towards iVTEC, is the lack of the defined changeover. After having an 01 prelude capable of 150+mph, real VTEC is fun. I have taken on countless Si civics in that prelude, and every time; that car would win. Not only that, but my daily is an 06 accord V6 6 speed sedan. I have taken on a few K24 equipped 2013+ si civics with the same results, my accord would win. The iVTEC cars just can't seem to keep up.

I have driven a 6 speed tsx and do like the performance of the K24, but another problem is that it is a very difficult swap. The most appealing part of a k swap is the 6 speed for fuel conservation when not on it. When I do drive it to work, it's a 92 mile round trip.

I have to think more about longevity of the vehicle. As a vehicle that my child does ride in, I don't want it to be too harsh for her.

I would love to be able to say that my wagon can do every single speed digit/hash mark on the gauge cluster, if not 150 mph. I have a knack for pushing every vehicle I have ever owned to their top speed. Although I don't race often, I want to have the power on tap.

I would be willing to consider a k swap, but only if a tsx/6 speed swap is feasible.

[mjsstanley]

Interesting Not sure what mods were done to your Accord or Prelude but from what I've seen, NO stock H22 will walk over a stock K24 unless the K driver doesn't know how to drive. iVTEC does have a less noticeable crossover but Honda is very smart, the iVTEC was designed to work much better than VTEC.

H22 is definitely still an awesome swap for our CB. However, if you take an H22 and a K24 with the exact same mods, the K24 will win every time.

[Jarrett]

The iVTEC cars just can't seem to keep up.

That's not a problem inherent in the iVTEC. Your car has 244hp and a very aggressively-geared (given the torque) 6-speed. I drive a 3.2CL-S. They're much faster than people typically give them credit for. Again, that's not because of iVTEC. It's because Honda has chosen to limit the power of the Civic Si to around 200hp. With 25% less power, driver shortcomings on part of the Civic driver are going to be a lot more evident.

I would be willing to consider a k swap, but only if a tsx/6 speed swap is feasible.

It's feasible and has been done. Why wouldn't it be? The K24A2 had a 6-speed transmission available with the TSX.

[mjsstanley]

Oh yeah, forgot to chime in on that.. The Hasport Mounts made for the K swap into the CB supports the 5spd Accord or 6spd TSX tranny.