n/a or turbo

[wvcb7]

so im buying an h22 and i've been watching videos on you tube. i have seen some baddass h22's with itb's and i have seen some sick h22 turbo's beating lambo's but im not sure which to do which would you guys pick also do i need to have it sleeved?

[HondaB18]

You don't need to get it sleeved if its nothing outrageous for the power output.

NA VS FI always boils down to personal preference. What we do shouldn't matter since you're asking about what you should do.

[wed3k]

h22? id build it for NA and if i was feeling lucky...nitrous.
h22 already has an advantage of a stock 190-200hp. it also doesnt weigh all that much more, plus high compression motors sound nice when they scream.

[NAiL05]

Personal preference. NA if you dont know anything about boost. Funny thing is big turbo fwd will beat most anything at a roll but fail badly at a dead stop unless you have full slick on or something of that nature.

[GenDBlade]

id build the NA. the H is already pretty kicking. but then again it is up to personal preference. but from what ive heard(and read) turbo can be a bitch to take care of.

[flight50]

do more research on both and it will give you a better idea of whats involved. have a power goal set. are you doing a street or track car. a good n/a build can be just as expensive as a turbo build. n/a you get raw power. and itb are bad ass but it has drawbacks. turbo you get delayed power but a greater output of it than n/a. take in mind the weight to power ratio. the more weight your car has, will slow its potential time wise in a race. the main factor is time and money. do it right the first time and your better off. get the best tuner you can. good parts and a turner can make or break you regardless the direction your going.

[mozzandherb]

do more research on both and it will give you a better idea of whats involved. have a power goal set. are you doing a street or track car. a good n/a build can be just as expensive as a turbo build. n/a you get raw power. and itb are bad ass but it has drawbacks. turbo you get delayed power but a greater output of it than n/a. take in mind the weight to power ratio. the more weight your car has, will slow its potential time wise in a race. the main factor is time and money. do it right the first time and your better off. get the best tuner you can. good parts and a turner can make or break you regardless the direction your going.

Some very good points here. Tuning is very very important. When you have ITB's I have heard that they are hard to tune and some tuners avoid them altogether. And like was mentioned a good N/A can be just as or more expensive than a decent turbo setup. Either which way you decide though, you will encounter unforseen problems that cost money. I have a boosted h22a on a stock block, and I don't abuse the car (except maybe at the track), but it is well tuned and I used quality parts. I have changed many key components to make this setup work, but of course it's always a work in progress. I decided to boost, alot of people migth decide to build a nice N/A, it's your choice in the end

[jm991700]

I was in the same boat as u was. I was at first going N/A. BUt my boy wanted to put a turbo on his car. SO he got me thinking about turbos then. SO i did the research and decided to go with a turbo. ANd i love it. No matter what u do to a H22 N/a, it will never produce the torque and Hp that a turbo would.Everybody i took for a ride in my car, they want a turbo on there car now. I would say get a chance to exprience a turbo honda, then make your decision.BUt when it comes down to it, do whats best for u.If u dont know how to do a lot of our own work on your car, then i would recommend u getting a turbo.

[DraZtiK]

I was in the same boat as u was. I was at first going N/A. BUt my boy wanted to put a turbo on his car. SO he got me thinking about turbos then. SO i did the research and decided to go with a turbo. ANd i love it. No matter what u do to a H22 N/a, it will never produce the torque and Hp that a turbo would.Everybody i took for a ride in my car, they want a turbo on there car now. I would say get a chance to exprience a turbo honda, then make your decision.BUt when it comes down to it, do whats best for u.If u dont know how to do a lot of our own work on your car, then i would recommend u getting a turbo.

your the prime example example why someone wouldn't go turbo.. i took my buddies for a ride and now they wanna go turbo.. everyone and their mom is going turbo in honda's these days just so they can produce power for cheaper but the question is... can you put your cars power to the ground?

and i'm sorry did you just say that if you don't know a lot about cars then go turbo? was that a joke? no one should go turbo if they don't know what they are doing... "oh look i'm hitting more boost, its way faster!" then boom..

and i'd say to you with a good setup on a H22 for turbo the money spent could have a fast N/A H22.. I'd say for you to get a ride in a N/A honda thats got more than bolt ons and maybe you'd change your mind. another thing power means nothing.. its about putting the power to the ground.. turbo hondas spin like a bitch.. its what they do.. would you rather have something that spins its bitch off or something that hooks and goes? the choice is up to you but thats my opinion.. and jm991700 never say if you don't know how to do stuff to you car then go turbo.. thats one of the most stupid thing i've ever heard.

[mozzandherb]

your the prime example example why someone wouldn't go turbo.. i took my buddies for a ride and now they wanna go turbo.. everyone and their mom is going turbo in honda's these days just so they can produce power for cheaper but the question is... can you put your cars power to the ground?

and i'm sorry did you just say that if you don't know a lot about cars then go turbo? was that a joke? no one should go turbo if they don't know what they are doing... "oh look i'm hitting more boost, its way faster!" then boom..

and i'd say to you with a good setup on a H22 for turbo the money spent could have a fast N/A H22.. I'd say for you to get a ride in a N/A honda thats got more than bolt ons and maybe you'd change your mind. another thing power means nothing.. its about putting the power to the ground.. turbo hondas spin like a bitch.. its what they do.. would you rather have something that spins its bitch off or something that hooks and goes? the choice is up to you but thats my opinion.. and jm991700 never say if you don't know how to do stuff to you car then go turbo.. thats one of the most stupid thing i've ever heard.

Enter a traction bar, some good motor mounts and some slicks for the track...that should help put the power down a little bit better

[jm991700]

your the prime example example why someone wouldn't go turbo.. i took my buddies for a ride and now they wanna go turbo.. everyone and their mom is going turbo in honda's these days just so they can produce power for cheaper but the question is... can you put your cars power to the ground?

and i'm sorry did you just say that if you don't know a lot about cars then go turbo? was that a joke? no one should go turbo if they don't know what they are doing... "oh look i'm hitting more boost, its way faster!" then boom..

and i'd say to you with a good setup on a H22 for turbo the money spent could have a fast N/A H22.. I'd say for you to get a ride in a N/A honda thats got more than bolt ons and maybe you'd change your mind. another thing power means nothing.. its about putting the power to the ground.. turbo hondas spin like a bitch.. its what they do.. would you rather have something that spins its bitch off or something that hooks and goes? the choice is up to you but thats my opinion.. and jm991700 never say if you don't know how to do stuff to you car then go turbo.. thats one of the most stupid thing i've ever heard.

First of all i type that wrong, i meant to say that if u dont know how to work on cars, i wouldnt put a turbo on a honda. And second u dont knwo what u talking about, A N/a wouldnt be faster then a good turbo setup turbo. A honda turbo N/a would never produce the same torque that a turbo can produce.IT just dont happen. And i dont understand putting a lot of money in a honda N/A to just produce maybe 40 to 50 hp.When u can spend the same money on a turbo setup and get a lot more hp and torque. I done a lot of research and took classes to know what to do to get what u want.

[Dep22build]

First of all i type that wrong, i meant to say that if u dont know how to work on cars, i wouldnt put a turbo on a honda. And second u dont knwo what u talking about, A N/a wouldnt be faster then a good turbo setup turbo. A honda turbo N/a would never produce the same torque that a turbo can produce.IT just dont happen. And i dont understand putting a lot of money in a honda N/A to just produce maybe 40 to 50 hp.When u can spend the same money on a turbo setup and get a lot more hp and torque. I done a lot of research and took classes to know what to do to get what u want.

This is an article from jeff at import builders
Comparison

B16A 1.74 liters

GSR 1.797 liters

B20 1.997 liters

Low boost torque

149 lbs

160 lbs

175 lbs

High boost torque

197 lbs

214 lbs

238 lbs

Which one will hook up the best; have the least amount of wheel spin and the best power band? Look at these charts… B16A flat out dominates. Undisputed. King. The thing is, nobody wants it. They all insist on building 2 liter turbo motors. And those motors are great in 3rd, 4th or 5th gear for sure, keeping up with bikes in some cases. But its going to get worked by any domestic V8 on any freeway onramp, and from any stop. Versus the B16A turbo I can actually launch very MEAN from a dead stop with less than 150 lbs of torque and when it hits 2nd gear, its going strong. I shift the GSR into second gear I get a big stripe on the floor, I shift the B20 into second gear and I hit the rev limiter from massive wheel spin (of course all of first gear was wheel spin too). Also, with a b16A motor you don’t get peak HP until very high in the RPM which is another advantage because you will be going a higher MPH when you hit the most power. AND you will have the least amount of torque! Versus a 2 liter where you will peak at about 7600 RPM or so, and have the most amount of torque. On that motor, you will have less MPH, more HP and more torque. Not a good combination. You want the tires to reach more MPH before more power touches the ground. It’s as simple as that. That’s why people buy longer gears for first gear, so they can get 10 more MPH out of first gear before they hit maximum power. This creates more traction. Ever wonder why all motor cars that weigh about the same just KILL turbo cars that have up to 300 horsepower more? Or even 50 HP more. Because the more horsepower, the less the car is going to hook, and the all motor car is GONE, with you catching up. Before you know it, you run out of track. And then you always hear the almost “guaranteed” excuse from the super high HP turbo guy. “I didn’t hook up, I was just spinning, and if I didn’t spin I would have killed you”. LOL that’s a laugh, when you hear that line just say “want to race again, double or nothing??” And kill him again, and again, and again. All day. What a joke! People actually expect their 400 wheel horsepower car to hook up and be neck and neck with all motor cars! And some cars I hear have 600 + WHP and want to race all motor cars for money. Can I borrow 10 grand to bet on the all motor car? No 600+ WHP cars or even 500+ WHP cars is going to hook for crap on the street without wheelie bars, and some HUGE slicks and $1000 dollar axles. On top of that, the more HP you have, the more skill and harder the car is to drive. So consistency is very, very difficult to achieve without the utmost practice and conditions. This is why the fast domestics go with power glide trannies. That is a 2 speed, automatic tranny. All they have to do is floor it and steer and they run fast, and consistent. If they had to shift gears 4 times like a Honda they would have a 20x harder time at it. Driving an all motor car that runs low 13’s compared to a turbo car that “can” run 11’s is like slow motion. I feel like I can sip a coke between shifts on the all motor car, while the turbo car is just: shift, bam, bam, bam, it’s over…very hard, or harder I should say.

[d112crzy]

First of all i type that wrong, i meant to say that if u dont know how to work on cars, i wouldnt put a turbo on a honda. And second u dont knwo what u talking about, A N/a wouldnt be faster then a good turbo setup turbo. A honda turbo N/a would never produce the same torque that a turbo can produce.IT just dont happen. And i dont understand putting a lot of money in a honda N/A to just produce maybe 40 to 50 hp.When u can spend the same money on a turbo setup and get a lot more hp and torque. I done a lot of research and took classes to know what to do to get what u want.

Well those classes did nothing for you. Get your money back.

It sounds like all you care about are power numbers.

Those are worthless when you can't put it down on the ground.

A 250whp NA build will go down the 1320 faster than a 300whp turbo build would, both in the same chassis. (if both driven by drivers with identical driving abilities and both builds are built for the purpose of fastest acceleration down the track)

The turbo will have a higher trap speed tho.

Power numbers are for dyno queens and posers.

[jm991700]

This is an article from jeff at import builders
Comparison

B16A 1.74 liters

GSR 1.797 liters

B20 1.997 liters

Low boost torque

149 lbs

160 lbs

175 lbs

High boost torque

197 lbs

214 lbs

238 lbs

Which one will hook up the best; have the least amount of wheel spin and the best power band? Look at these charts… B16A flat out dominates. Undisputed. King. The thing is, nobody wants it. They all insist on building 2 liter turbo motors. And those motors are great in 3rd, 4th or 5th gear for sure, keeping up with bikes in some cases. But its going to get worked by any domestic V8 on any freeway onramp, and from any stop. Versus the B16A turbo I can actually launch very MEAN from a dead stop with less than 150 lbs of torque and when it hits 2nd gear, its going strong. I shift the GSR into second gear I get a big stripe on the floor, I shift the B20 into second gear and I hit the rev limiter from massive wheel spin (of course all of first gear was wheel spin too). Also, with a b16A motor you don’t get peak HP until very high in the RPM which is another advantage because you will be going a higher MPH when you hit the most power. AND you will have the least amount of torque! Versus a 2 liter where you will peak at about 7600 RPM or so, and have the most amount of torque. On that motor, you will have less MPH, more HP and more torque. Not a good combination. You want the tires to reach more MPH before more power touches the ground. It’s as simple as that. That’s why people buy longer gears for first gear, so they can get 10 more MPH out of first gear before they hit maximum power. This creates more traction. Ever wonder why all motor cars that weigh about the same just KILL turbo cars that have up to 300 horsepower more? Or even 50 HP more. Because the more horsepower, the less the car is going to hook, and the all motor car is GONE, with you catching up. Before you know it, you run out of track. And then you always hear the almost “guaranteed” excuse from the super high HP turbo guy. “I didn’t hook up, I was just spinning, and if I didn’t spin I would have killed you”. LOL that’s a laugh, when you hear that line just say “want to race again, double or nothing??” And kill him again, and again, and again. All day. What a joke! People actually expect their 400 wheel horsepower car to hook up and be neck and neck with all motor cars! And some cars I hear have 600 + WHP and want to race all motor cars for money. Can I borrow 10 grand to bet on the all motor car? No 600+ WHP cars or even 500+ WHP cars is going to hook for crap on the street without wheelie bars, and some HUGE slicks and $1000 dollar axles. On top of that, the more HP you have, the more skill and harder the car is to drive. So consistency is very, very difficult to achieve without the utmost practice and conditions. This is why the fast domestics go with power glide trannies. That is a 2 speed, automatic tranny. All they have to do is floor it and steer and they run fast, and consistent. If they had to shift gears 4 times like a Honda they would have a 20x harder time at it. Driving an all motor car that runs low 13’s compared to a turbo car that “can” run 11’s is like slow motion. I feel like I can sip a coke between shifts on the all motor car, while the turbo car is just: shift, bam, bam, bam, it’s over…very hard, or harder I should say.

First of all, anyone who knows what they doing, is not going to floor a turbo honda. Thats just stupid. I spin in my turbo honda, so if im racing why would i floor it when all im going to do is spin. I good driver knows how to fix that. With a all motor honda, u going to have spin also, but not as bad, but u will spend also. My cousin has a 06 honda si. When he took it to the track, we was spining like hell also. I good driver would know how much to press the padel down, so he or she will get less well spin. Its called practice.I put money on when i go to the track, an N/A honda is not going to bet me, unless i fuck up. lol that happens to. Im not saying a N/A is a bad thing, i was going to do one myself.

[d112crzy]

A good driver ALWAYS floors it.