the "dbsharp is gonna learn how to tune" thread

[dbsharp]

I have spring break this week so im going to be spending A LOT of time attempting to tune my car. Im going to compile all of my questions into one thread, along with answers I find / observations of mine, and maybe one day when I have the knowledge I will make some tutorial to make the learning proses smoother for noobs like me.
ok the first thing that is puzzling me. I got a map from mrx, (thanks!), for f22b dohc, this map is on p30 code, so iab's are not supported. I have my iab's controlled by the ecu, so I attempted to transfer the information to a p72 base. I made all the row and column headers the same and copy and pasted fuel and ignition maps. I looked at some of the advanced tables and made changes where I thought it would be necessary. The car wouldn't start. The one table that I didn't change which I think is source of the problem is the crank fuel compensation (didn't realize this until I started typing), this does not seem isolated. the car wont run on either uber map that d112crzy made that I have, I have had problem's with maps just not working sometimes when I change absolutely nothing about the map or burning process. It would run no problem on the f22b na map that mrx gave me though.
one more thing that concerns me though, is if the stock o2 sensor will become damaged if i leave it unplugged while tuning. innovative states that an unpowered o2 sensor will quickly become damaged. can I wire a switch into the signal wire for the stock o2 sensor to keep it safe when I don't wanna use it?

[d112crzy]

Just take it out and plug the bung dude.

But since you're going to be tuning, just tune everything and you'll never have to worry about the o2 again.

If you're having starting issues with crome, mess with the injector offsets ONLY until you get it running.

I have another map if you wish to try. It will be rich because it was tuned for some delta 260's.

[dbsharp]

ok. I dont plan on using the o2 once tuned, but I am using the stock ecu when im not tuning. alot of the time I only have 1 hour to spend on it at a time so taking it out reduces the time I have to spend on it, but I will do what has to be done. I think im gonna try to hook up the lc1 to the battery temporarily so that I can measure my afr during crank. thanks

[MRX]

most widebands take 10-30 seconds to warm up and produce readings, more than likely you won't get a reading for start-ups. Besides what numbers would you be looking for anyways? 14.7 wouldn't mean a thing at start-up. Change the map little by little, go back to my map, change the a/f's at idle and such and see if just changing things in the fuel map mess up the entire map. I think you're doing too much too be honest. One step at a time. I'll see if i can get my car running on the p72 code over the weekend if you remind me.

[dbsharp]

im gonna try to do it tomorrow. I plan on doing one thing at a time. my first order of business is getting it to idle properly. Ive been reading all day, and I think I am going to be able to get it to start and idle properly at the very least.

[d112crzy]

That really should only take about 5 minutes with crome.

[MRX]

if you want this to be hard then I won't give you the map. I commend you, the hard way is exactly how i learned. Have aspirin handy lol.

[d112crzy]

I think we should give him the honor of having him learn the hard way.

it's the best way.

[MRX]

no doubt. Pay your dues dbsharp.

...no, I'm serious. Send me $10 lol.

[dbsharp]

I prefer to figure things out on my own. I never pay attention in class, I just read the book and teach myself. Anyway, while logging in the p72 based map (while cranking), I get 0 rpm, 0 injector duration, ignition advance stays at -6, but the map sensor reads increased vacuum while cranking, which makes me think that data logging is working. I read the chip that I burned and opened the bin up and it looks fine. I cant find A single thing wrong with it as far as I can tell. I'm gonna mess around with it more when I get off work.

[MRX]

cool, what are you using to log? If your tps works then you're probably datalogging fine.

[dbsharp]

the newest freelog. Ill check to see if tps logging works in the no start map I made. If it does then I guess I my injectors just arn't opening and I need to find out the source of the problem. I think that next I will experiment with a stock p72 map to see If it has the same problem (i don't think it will), and then change things one by one like I have them now to see what the culprit is. I have no clue why d112crzy's map wont start and run my car, because it has before. I tried to burn d112's f22b dohc map to a chip 3 times in a row a while back and on the third try It worked. I didn't change anything at all between the three attempts, because I was frustrated and had had no luck that night, and I was just hoping for it to work. I have no clue why it finally started working. I'm just wondering if maybe I have some bad hardware. Ill be doing a lot of testing and investigating tomorrow, so maybe I get this figured out.

[dbsharp]

ok so tps and iat and ect and map works while logging and still no injector duration while cranking. Also downloaded a fresh copy of d112's f22b map and it works fine. I added the use of ac switch to ftl in his map saved it and burned it. now it doesn't crank and I get a cel.

[dbsharp]

stock p72 map now starts the car and runs with some minor mods. I just updated my crome and I love the newest features that have been added. now I have some stock battery offest tables to choose from that actually work.
One thing that really concerns me, is the base ignition table. so it looks like crome adds timing to the values on the table. I'm worried that If I use timing table values from another map like the one mrx gave me or the one d112crzy posted, then the new crome will add the timing specified in the table to the ignition map and the result will be a blown motor. ignition timing is something Im not trying to learn right away, and I really just want to know that my ign timing is safe. also my datalogging works half assed now. I have a feeling that im just gonna keep on running into complications and headaches like this for a while. well, back to pgmfi I go.
im using 1.4.8 now

[MRX]

If the motor is stock and low compression like our motors naturally are then don't worry about the ignition timing messing up the motor. It is EXTREMELY hard to hurt a motor unless your actually making power or have upwards or past 11:1 compression. You'll be bucking back and forth with our compression if the timing isn't right. It won't just sneak up on you.