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Help with picking turbo :D

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    #1

    Help with picking turbo :D

    Question is not for I, but my buddy who actually has a cb7. I got a 96 .

    Anyways he's mocking up a rebuild of his f22a4 and wants to go the turbo route. My natural aspiration ways could not sway him other wise

    He look at turbonetics site with me earlier and other than spending a grand on one of theirs, wants to know what you guys think of this one

    http://usedturbos.net/Catalog/Rebuil...-T4-Turbo.html

    Its used so i dont think its wise, but it is rebuilt. Is that an appropriate size for his 2.2 f22? Everything looks like hes going stock other than new rods and a overbore with a hone with some fresh pistons for a good ring seal. Ill try to get him to make an account but anyways, opinions? or is he being a cheap ass and getting a cruddy turbo?
    Originally posted by deevergote
    Installing a turbo and planning to tune later is kinda like having sex and planning to put the condom on afterward.
    Tags: None
    #2
    the exhaust housing looks ebay. ehh for that much id rather tell him to get a real used turbonetics turbo
    miss my turbo cb7
    moved onto volvos. dont know how that happened, just did

    Comment

      #3
      Id stay away from it for a number of reasons.

      1)Its a T4 turbo, which is a pretty big flange for our little engines.

      A T3/T4 would be better.

      2)If I was in the market for a turbo I would buy it used, not rebuilt and rebuild it myself so I knew it was done right. Its really not that expensive, and "used" turbos can be had in perfectly functional condition that dont even need a rebuild.

      3)The manifold would probably have to be custom made since most of them available to us are T3 flanged.

      4)Dsm manifolds are 100x easier to come by and cheaper with better turbo options.

      5)This turbo will make his OEM rebuilt engine explode. Its too much turbo for his car if it supports 525 WHP, and flows like a 3076R.

      6)EVO 3 MHI 16g turbo, and a 2g DSM manifold would be cheaper for both then what this turbo costs, and would be a good turbo for the car with loads of potential.

      7) If the EVO 3 wasnt big enough, Holset has an entire line of cheap quality turbos that fit the manifold as well, and are pretty reasonable for a HUGE turbo. Read about it.
      Originally posted by wed3k
      im a douchebag to people and i don't even own a lambo. whats your point? we, douchbags, come in all sorts of shapes and colours.

      Comment

        #4
        I don't know about getting a DSM so I won't comment on that. But if he's willing to pay that much for a used turbo he can save about an extra hundred and buy a brand new Precision 6076 which is T3/T4, spool quicker, and would put up bigger numbers IMHO.

        I do agree with toycar that alot of those turbos look like knockoffs. Maybe some parts are actually Garrett, or Precision, but not the entire turbo.
        '94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq

        Originally posted by deevergote
        If you say double dutch rudder, i'm banning you...

        Comment

          #5
          Thanks a bunch guys! Lots of information there. I know nothing about turbos but what are the DSM's from exactly? I know on honda-tech some people get mixed up and use real small DSM ones and everyone always rags on them about it running way to hot.

          Anyways, he found treadstone's site and it looks to be like hes getting t3/t4 hybrid next month or so. (his broke ass ). Looks like they have all the bells and whistles over on that web site. Other than a REALLY ugly ebay or treadstone "log" manifold, does anyone make an equal length one for his car? He was looking at the piping offered on treadstone's site but i know he and i really arent really the kind to custom make an exhaust manifold...
          Originally posted by deevergote
          Installing a turbo and planning to tune later is kinda like having sex and planning to put the condom on afterward.

          Comment

            #6
            Originally posted by BIGsnorlax View Post
            Thanks a bunch guys! Lots of information there. I know nothing about turbos but what are the DSM's from exactly? I know on honda-tech some people get mixed up and use real small DSM ones and everyone always rags on them about it running way to hot.

            Anyways, he found treadstone's site and it looks to be like hes getting t3/t4 hybrid next month or so. (his broke ass ). Looks like they have all the bells and whistles over on that web site. Other than a REALLY ugly ebay or treadstone "log" manifold, does anyone make an equal length one for his car? He was looking at the piping offered on treadstone's site but i know he and i really arent really the kind to custom make an exhaust manifold...
            LOL here we go again.


            The 14b is the turbo rag about, and its because somewhere along the tuner lines people decided it was a good idea not to cool the turbo. As in, they dont hook coolant lines up to it as it was designe to run.

            Its an awesome/cheap turbo. Flows 405 CFM, and I can post a compressor map if need be.

            the other common turbo is the t25, which is way to small.

            16g is the best turbo from a DSM you can buy, it is from an evo.


            And Holset has an entire line of turbos that all fit the manifold as well.
            Originally posted by wed3k
            im a douchebag to people and i don't even own a lambo. whats your point? we, douchbags, come in all sorts of shapes and colours.

            Comment

              #7
              Originally posted by toycar View Post
              LOL here we go again.


              The 14b is the turbo rag about, and its because somewhere along the tuner lines people decided it was a good idea not to cool the turbo. As in, they dont hook coolant lines up to it as it was designe to run.

              Its an awesome/cheap turbo. Flows 405 CFM, and I can post a compressor map if need be.

              the other common turbo is the t25, which is way to small.

              16g is the best turbo from a DSM you can buy, it is from an evo.


              And Holset has an entire line of turbos that all fit the manifold as well.
              Thanks toycar! Those turbo names ring a bell so i think that would be the ones they were talking about... just wasnt sure.

              He's decided on the t3/t4 hybrids.

              http://www.treadstoneperformance.com...T3%2FT4+Turbos

              But has no reference for sizing he claims he just wants to crack 300-350whp and room to grow isnt a concern as he wants a fast spool up. Which of these would suit his needs well? I dont really know trim sizes in relation to how they perform. They have different stages.. and i dont know what those drop down numbers at the bottom mean when u pick a turbo it looks like u can select different A/R's for each turbo?

              Anyways this is really pissing me off so im just going to go beat him up until he makes his own account. I dont want to look like the dumby
              Originally posted by deevergote
              Installing a turbo and planning to tune later is kinda like having sex and planning to put the condom on afterward.

              Comment

                #8
                The 60 Trim Stage 3 is probably the one I would pick but I would still recommend the Precision 6076 which I recommended earlier as it is more turbo for your money. I realize you said you're not concerned with room for growth but honestly why buy a turbo and max out around 475whp when you can pay the same price and with the right internals max out at 700whp? I mean it's a no-brainer to me.

                There aren't really any manifolds out there for the CB7. For equal runner manifolds your best bet is to look for a RevHard, Peakboost, or Full Race manifold used. If you purchase new those manifolds can rival almost $1000 each. Keep in mind that you might not be able to retain A/C. Some of these manifolds are also twin scroll so you would have to get a much more powerful turbo. But it doesn't look like that's in your friends budget so you are pretty much limited to a Treadstone, OBX, eBay log style manifolds.
                '94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq

                Originally posted by deevergote
                If you say double dutch rudder, i'm banning you...

                Comment

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Joey GT-R View Post
                  The 60 Trim Stage 3 is probably the one I would pick but I would still recommend the Precision 6076 which I recommended earlier as it is more turbo for your money. I realize you said you're not concerned with room for growth but honestly why buy a turbo and max out around 475whp when you can pay the same price and with the right internals max out at 700whp? I mean it's a no-brainer to me.

                  There aren't really any manifolds out there for the CB7. For equal runner manifolds your best bet is to look for a RevHard, Peakboost, or Full Race manifold used. If you purchase new those manifolds can rival almost $1000 each. Keep in mind that you might not be able to retain A/C. Some of these manifolds are also twin scroll so you would have to get a much more powerful turbo. But it doesn't look like that's in your friends budget so you are pretty much limited to a Treadstone, OBX, eBay log style manifolds.
                  Thanks man, Now i understand BIGGER is more awesome. But if he decided to go with the precision liek you mentioned, wouldnt he experience more lag in the turbo since it is larger? As well as less response and loss of midrange?

                  He found this site = http://www.trackforged.com/store.php

                  And has the idea stuck in his mind that he can simply buy one of those, cut them from the exhaust flange and either machine a new flange for his F22 or locate on online? We dont have a welder between the two of us.. but he figures he could go to a shop and it would be simple for them to weld it onto a flange. thoughts on this?
                  Originally posted by deevergote
                  Installing a turbo and planning to tune later is kinda like having sex and planning to put the condom on afterward.

                  Comment

                    #10
                    Bigger is not always better. Too small can be bad, but too big will basically be useless.

                    The best thing to do is get a turbo that is properly sized to the engine, that will give the desired outcome. Unless you can read compressor maps, and have a good understanding of all the parts you're planning on installing, the "best" turbo is hard to determine.

                    Most guys in this crowd use used turbos, so they're not really picking the ideal unit for their plan. The Mitsubishi 14b and 16g turbos are decently suited to our cars (when used correctly), so that takes a lot of the thought out of it.

                    Honestly, if you (and your friend) don't know the details of turbo system design, your next best option would be to review the turbo systems built by some of our more experienced members and copy them part for part.






                    Comment

                      #11
                      Originally posted by BIGsnorlax
                      He found this site = http://www.trackforged.com/store.php

                      And has the idea stuck in his mind that he can simply buy one of those, cut them from the exhaust flange and either machine a new flange for his F22 or locate on online? We dont have a welder between the two of us.. but he figures he could go to a shop and it would be simple for them to weld it onto a flange. thoughts on this?
                      I don't recommend cutting a manifold like that. Are your welds going to be the same as Forged's welds? I doubt it. That could probably decrease the efficiency, life, and definitely the warranty. If you're going to spend all that money you might as well ask Forged, SpeedFactory, LoveFab, Full-Race, etc to just fabricate you one.

                      Or perhaps you could get dbsharp to hook you up I believe he makes ramhorns for F22s.
                      Originally posted by deevergote
                      Bigger is not always better. Too small can be bad, but too big will basically be useless.

                      The best thing to do is get a turbo that is properly sized to the engine, that will give the desired outcome. Unless you can read compressor maps, and have a good understanding of all the parts you're planning on installing, the "best" turbo is hard to determine.
                      I wouldn't say it's overly bigger(+2mm), it does come in a .48 and .63 exhaust option as well; but for my H22 I plan to purchase the .82 A/R. But I would say it is of better quality. It also has their latest exhaust wheel which is used in billet turbos for greater top end power; hence the higher horsepower ceiling.
                      '94 JDM H22A: 178whp 146wtq

                      Originally posted by deevergote
                      If you say double dutch rudder, i'm banning you...

                      Comment

                        #12
                        Garret's website has instructions on how to do the proper calculations to determine what turbo is best for you based on a compressor map.
                        There are no black and white suspension answers!!!!!!!!!!!

                        Comment

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