H22 Turbo: good? Bad?

[drr86]

So I've noticed that not a whole lot of people that do the H22 swap have turboed them. Is there a particular reason for that? Compression too high or something? Or am I just smoking something and there is in fact an abundance of turbo h22's? Or is it even just a matter of preference and not a lot of people see reason to turbo an h22?

[Kurobei]

Lots of factors...

Well one factor would be just money. Putting a H22a in a cb7 is already a tight fit and there's issues with the A/C etc. or manifolds clearing our front motor mount. There is no turbokit made for a H22A in cb7 except for the TSI kit and I believe that kit was around 2,500-2,800 complete with a dinky sized turbo. There is a Drag kit made for a F22a in a cb7 but thats a little over 3G's and isnt' smog legal if u live in a "cool" state such as California You could probably get this kit and swap the manifold for a Drag2 log style and matched downpipe that will alow u to retain A/C. and it won't hit ur motormount or stock radiator if u don't aquire a slim fan or civic radiator

Those are only some of the cons...fitment and money

The reason why I think most people don't turbo H22a's is because of the spread rumours on Honda-tech and the net saying H22A's are shit motors to turbo because they have weak sleeves. True they don't accept boost much but who would go more than 7-8psi on a stock motor??? but most people get "boost happy" and try boosting over the recommended amount and blow shit up or crack rings.

I have a friend that has a 97 prelude thats been turboed for 3years now at 8psi on a stock motor. He has a Revhard kit and the thing runs fine with no problems whatsoever. He also takes care of his car and doesn't go V-tec'in everywhere and doing 3rd gear drops to show off his car is turbo. The people that are "boosthappy" are probably beatin the shit out of their motors everyday and break simple internal engine components. Something simple like oil seals shrinking and moving and causing oil leaks in the sparkplugs can cause miss fires or worn out sparkplugs causing detonation with the turbo.
This is probably the least common but it's a possible effect. Some honda engines dont' come stock from factory with a turbo so the blocks aren't made to handle the abuse. That being said...no honda block should really be turboed if it's for everyday racing/or freeway merging abuse unless it's built. No block is really better than another in the longrun. A f22 has stronger sleeves than h22 but putting the same kinda abuse and psi on the block doesn't mean it'll last longer or that it's better. Sometimes its just luck

I'm in the process of gathering items for my turbo project and I don't plan on sleeving my motor. I'm going to order some forgedpistons and rings made by... mahle but supposingly they fit the block without sleeving. I'm also going to get a hondata gasket to make things run a little cooler, throw some NGK iridium IX 2step colder plugs, upgraded fuel pump and a few misc things and boost only a conservative 5psi on my auto and call it a day. I have another friend that has a greddy turboed GSR and he's running 8psi and just has colder plugs, upgraded oil/fuel pump, and hondata shield and management. He races it alot....still running fine.

Very good examples of turboed CB7's that were built right the first time around are AccordSiR's and that crazy ass 600hp cb7 on hondatech.

If you want some extra insurance on the motor, get the motor built right the first time to handle the new power if u wanna go over 7psi and "drop it like it's hot"

[drr86]

Sweet, lots of great stuff. Thanks for the info! Now, what about the H20? I have heard that it might be a better fit for what I'm looking for. Supposedly it can handle a shit load more boost and shit, buy i'm not certain about the compatibility with the CB7. Is it an easy fit and would it be better to swap with a H22 or H20? Anyone?

I am researching and trying to figure out what the best swap would be for my ride. Right now I have a stock F22a6 with a few minor mods that has 161k on it, so I don't really think it will be worth while to go crazy with it (except when I get a sweet ass hand-me-down turbo and manifold from a galant vr-4 for free).

[GrayCar]

What the heck is an H20?

The big issue with boosting Hondas are the pistons, the ringlands tend to go. You can get some forged pistons and they will be much tougher. However, due to the material used to sleeve the H22 block (FRM), you cannot use a forged piston in an H22. The forged piston will tear up the block. Due to the pistons, you're pretty much limited to 7-8psi.

With an F22, you can use a forged piston. The F22 uses an iron sleeve and you can drop any forged piston in there and be on your way. The problem then becomes the bottom end of the F22 block (crank, etc.). That seems to be limiting guys to 10-12psi reliably.

As far as the H22, Wiseco used to make a FRM friendly forged piston but took it off the market after folks were scoring up their cylinders. Some other places will sell you a Wiseco piston that they've had coated to be FRM friendly. JUN sells a set of FRM friendly for over $1,300. Mahle also has a set (as noted above) but I only found them in one place and I never talked to Mahle themselves.

I stopped looking after I decided that for the cost of the pistons I could resleve the block and used forged.

[h22sparkle]

Yeah this is most interesting.

[Kurobei]

What the heck is an H20?

As far as the H22, Wiseco used to make a FRM friendly forged piston but took it off the market after folks were scoring up their cylinders. Some other places will sell you a Wiseco piston that they've had coated to be FRM friendly. JUN sells a set of FRM friendly for over $1,300. Mahle also has a set (as noted above) but I only found them in one place and I never talked to Mahle themselves.

I stopped looking after I decided that for the cost of the pistons I could resleve the block and used forged.

I think he means F20B?? I've heard and read somewhere that motor supposed to be good for boosting....but looking at the compression stats and since it's supposingly a detuned h22 motor with higher B-series type revability....I think it's no better for boosting right??

If I were to buy these Mahle pistons, does that mean I can skip sleeving and have a lower compression block making my motor safe for an "x" amount of boost? I mean if these pistons will do the trick then why sleeve?

I dunno man....u really got me thinking and it might be cost effective to just sleeve the block since the motor has to be torn apart anyways? I think the Mahle Gold series pistons are around 580-600ish not pimp factoring 1,300 like the JUNz..

[GrayCar]

The Mahle pistons look slick, but I have no idea what they're all about. I only saw them for sale on one web site (importprformance or something) also, which makes me question them. I was going to call Mahle and ask, but I ran out of interest after the JUN thing.

The Wiseco pistons... the pulled them. Now, some guys have run these and had no problems at all for 10-20k miles. Some guys run these and after a couple thousand they have scoring. The whole issue here is the piston slap. If the piston fits loosely in the cylinder, the skirts will 'slap' the cylinder wall. An iron sleeved block can put up with some of that, but the FRM sleeves in combination with the forged pistons will score.

The Wiseco FRM friendly pistons do seem to work, but the piston has to fit perfectly or you will frig your block.

Another source for pistons is www.theoldone.com. Though not listed, Endyne sells a Wiseco piston they have coated and claim is FRM friendly. A lot of other places sell or will coat a piston for you, but it all depends on the material they use. Some good, some bad, but I don't know enough about it to say. Of the places that sell a coated piston, I would probably trust Endyne the most, they really seem to know their shit.

The Mahle Golden Series (?)... call them, I'd be interested in hearing what they have to say.

Oh yeah, the Wiseco's also require a new rod, the wrist pin won't fit a standard rod.

I dunno, figure you can sleeve a block for $800 or so, get some forged pistons for $400 and in the end be better off... seems like a better idea than trying to find some FRM friendly pistons for a boost application. Cost wise they will be close and the re-sleeved block will be tougher in the long run.

Or, just run low boost, keep the RPM's down and be done.

[drr86]

What the heck is an H20?

Yeah, totally meant the F20b, my bad. Thanks for the realization, Kurobei. Well, I guess it really is just a preference thing for swaps, huh. It seems as though there really isn't a "best" choice when it comes to swaps. There may be reliable and common swaps, but not neccessarily a "best" swap. So thanks for all the great info, guys its invaluable, but I think I'm just gonna look for what suits me best and stop looking for the "best" swap out there for my car.

[kamaccord]

I'm in the process of completing my H22 turbo now.

[drr86]

Cool , how far along are you? If its almost complete, how has it been going for you?

[kamaccord]

Very costly! As a result of not having enough information for manifold that allow for keeping the A/C and power steering. If I had to do it again I would purchase the tubular exhaust manifold, 3 inch downpipe, and intercooler piping made by Rev Hard from camp 1320. Camp 1320 has the entire kit for the H22 for $2800.

[kamaccord]

I'm almost complete! I plan to take some pics over the weekend.

[drr86]

Sweet ass! Can't wait to see 'em.

BTW, I was looking at your ride pics and I think its sweet, its very similar to how I would want to do mine (If I didn't wanna keep my car a sleeper )

props, man

[h22sparkle]

well you better have a good tuner thats one 2 also you better make sure you custom fit everythign i plan to get a tubular manifold from a couple of good ass cheap and reliable resources

[92ex]

h22s blow when boosted dumbasses tune them and drive them. There the ones that ask "do I have to change my ecu when i boost?" and stuff like that. It's fine to boost, but watch ignition and the amount you boost.

OT, Kamaccord, I thought your car was done?