Info about Tb, intake, cam, ecu upgrades

[Pandemic]

In time (a year or so) I want to upgrade the throttle body, intake manifold, plenum, cam and ecu. I have headers and a 2.25" stainless exhaust system. My car is an automatic LX.

So, I need to make a shopping list. Here it is so far:

Throttle body
Which is best? H22, F22, custom?

Plenum
Which is best, H22, H23, custom?

Intake Manifold (runners)
F22A6
With or without butterfly valves
Should I get an extra spacer or any Bisi extras?

Cam
Which is best? Bisi level 1, delta 272? I want something better but I dont want to have to modify the heads too much. Do I need anything extra with this upgrade?

ECU
What the hell do I need and can I tune it?


Sometime when I get back I'd like to meet up with some members to do this upgrade. It should be doable in an afternoon, right?

[90LXCB7Newbie]

all the info u need is here...
http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/index.php?



search all ur questions and u will find more than enough info to answer ALL ur ?'s

[Pandemic]

all the info u need is here...
http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/index.php?



search all ur questions and u will find more than enough info to answer ALL ur ?'s

LOL, yeah that helps.

[wrichards2005]

Fuck doin all that stuff. Make your car a manual first.

[WilliamW]

Throttle body
Which is best? H22, F22, custom?

Plenum
Which is best, H22, H23, custom?

Intake Manifold
F22A6
With or without butterfly valves
Should I get an extra spacer or any Bisi extras?

Cam
Which is best? Bisi level 1, delta 272? I want something better but I dont want to have to modify the heads too much. Do I need anything extra with this upgrade?

ECU
What the hell do I need and can I tune it?

For intake systems, usually bigger is better. No matter what throttle body you get stock, anything you bore out yourself (professionally or personally) will almost always be better.

As for your plenum and intake manifold, I'm a bit confused here. Are you referring to the upper and lower parts of your intake as a whole? Last time I checked these two words could be swapped for each other. Their basically the same thing.

The cam and ECU are really tricky things. You could get whatever cam you wanted to. But I can't tell you how it's going to make your car run. It depends on what you have done to it, what your computer tune looks like, and what your ultimate goals are.

Ultimately it's about what you want. Just a bit more pep, or an all out NA / forced induction race car.

[Pandemic]

For intake systems, usually bigger is better. No matter what throttle body you get stock, anything you bore out yourself (professionally or personally) will almost always be better.

As for your plenum and intake manifold, I'm a bit confused here. Are you referring to the upper and lower parts of your intake as a whole? Last time I checked these two words could be swapped for each other. Their basically the same thing.

The cam and ECU are really tricky things. You could get whatever cam you wanted to. But I can't tell you how it's going to make your car run. It depends on what you have done to it, what your computer tune looks like, and what your ultimate goals are.

Ultimately it's about what you want. Just a bit more pep, or an all out NA / forced induction race car.

Plenum = big air tank thingy on top of the runners. Ah, Yeah my mistake, I meant runners.

[bcjammerx]

imo, a combo being h22/23 (or big baller s2k)tb, h22/23 upper, a6 lower, functioning IAB's (depending on setup...some delete all together run just spacers), blacktrax spacer (plastic...not metal).

that seems to be the best...later...you can pay a hair more and bore and p/p the stock combo.

I mean for the price you will pay, the gains from a "performance" one aren't worth it to me. There are plenty of folks here making good power with modified stock components (ported...bored...polished)...sure some are done to the extreme but seems to me that what they spent was less overall then buying those "performance" ones. Some did it themselves and only had to pay for the used intake pieces.


http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=132043
good port and polish thread

http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=12927
and another one...directly related to the above

[Pandemic]

imo, a combo being h22/23 (or big baller s2k)tb, h22/23 upper, a6 lower, functioning IAB's (depending on setup...some delete all together run just spacers), blacktrax spacer (plastic...not metal).

that seems to be the best...later...you can pay a hair more and bore and p/p the stock combo.

I mean for the price you will pay, the gains from a "performance" one aren't worth it to me. There are plenty of folks here making good power with modified stock components (ported...bored...polished)...sure some are done to the extreme but seems to me that what they spent was less overall then buying those "performance" ones. Some did it themselves and only had to pay for the used intake pieces.


http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=132043
good port and polish thread

http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=12927
and another one...directly related to the above

If you run the H22/H23 TB, H22/H23 plenum, A6 runners, and IAB's (what does IAB stand for? - butterfly valves right?), you'll NEED the upgraded ECU right? What ECU is that?

Also, if you're going to do that you may as well upgrade the cam shaft, eh?

What are the power expectations from upgrading an F22A1 engine with H22 TB, H22 plenum, A6 runners, functional IAB's, spacer, a6 or Delta 272 cam (much of a difference?) , A6 ECU, 4-2-1 2.25" exhaust, and a short ram intake?

I'm just curious about the power increase.
Thanks!

[bcjammerx]

well if you swap all the stock parts over you'll need the pt6 (not to be confused with the p06) ecu from the car with an a6 engine. You'll have the same hp as a stock a6...well you'd also need the windage tray for the oil pan though.

Uhm....h23/23 tb and plenum on top of the a6 runners, Might gain a little...I think you get mostly better throttle response...I know there's a sticky or something that give estimates on what all together you'll gain over and a1 but i don't recall so I'm not gonna try to quote it or give an est. Found the sticky...says 30 hp...so 150ish?

the iabs are valves inbetween the plenum and runners that vary the intake runners lengths based on rpms...you HAVE to have the a6 ecu and the black box that attaches under the runners...it might not "add" hp...it just keeps it available through a wider curve.

a blacktrax (or other plastic spacer) placed above the plenum...or below the IAB plate...not sure it matters, has been shown to add 5hp...there's a thread...but a metal plate (while not confirmed) may not as it is metal and will heat soak..unlike the plastic spacer.

bisi stage one is well recommended, 5-10% power increase? Again...thread around here somewhere and I don't recall so I dunno for sure.

you'll need an ecu tune with a stage two, which means chipped ecu...there's a list of chippable ecu's...ones that give you options when chipping as you CAN chip any ecu...you just don't get all the options.

If you did all that...(30+hp stock upgrade on a1) added 2.5" exhaust too...2.25" maybe...but in the end you'll want 2.5"...you might see...150...MAYBE if you're lucky...oh yeah...that's at the crank...not the wheels...someone correct me if I'm wrong.

I've seen some pretty low whp numbers with all these...minus bisi cam...like 130...so don't expect too much...head work, chipped ecu, and stage 2 cam, larger header...may get you to 160-165. Look over cisco's red build...keep in mind he did NOT build that for MOST power though...the white build is still underway...those are some good N/A references.

When I finish my suspension upgrades I will finish the a1-a6 conversion + I/H/E upgrades, I intend on doing a dyno pull...to add to the n/a f22 dyno charts. I will have basically and f22a6 with CAI, h22 tb, h23 plenum, 2.25" cat back.

Not sure if I will get the blacktrax spacer and a decent header.

[HondaFan81]

My suggestions for your LX auto with F22a1 motor:

TB/IM - Install an H23 TB and H23 intake manifold all together, keep it stock.

Camshaft - Bisimoto F22ax level 1 camshaft with stock valve springs, if they are in good condition (otherwise buy Bisimoto valve springs). If you go F22 level 2, then buy the Bisimoto valve springs.

Engine management - Chipped P06 ECU with Chrome if on budget, as most tuners on this forum use this freeware. Otherwise, get a Hondata S200 for the P06 ECU and find any reputable dyno tuner.

Dyno tuning - Whether you go freeware or Hondata, you will need to budget for dyno use.

Install Timing - The install of the TB/intake manifold and camshaft can be done in one day. However, I would change your timing belt if mileage calls for it (water pump also), since you will be revving this engine with the mods. You will need another day (may not be predictable) for dyno use, as you need to schedule this with a shop. If you do this ahead of time then perhaps all this can be done in one weekend. Most dyno shops are closed Sunday.

Friday - Install parts, verify all is working correctly. If freeware with local tuner, they should make a decent basemap to get you to dyno shop for final tune. Whether the local tuner or shop does the final tune, is up to you.

Saturday - Prescheduled dyno use day.

[Pandemic]

Yiesh, total cost sounds like it's going to be close to $700 for everything. I dont even know a dyno tuning shop in my area (at home) :P

[Pandemic]

do you really need to tune for a cam and intake upgrades?

[NinJa_FLiP]

u can get away with the intake upgrades without the tune.. but def. need the tune for the cams.. so before u mess with all that stuff, i think its best you get that sucker dyno tuned with a basemap.. that way u can bring back and retune it for any future upgrades you do..