Phantom Grip

[deevergote]

I could have sworn I posted about this before, but a search yeilded nothing...

What's up with it? Anyone ever try it, or know someone who did? The price is great, at a third of the cost of a real LSD. Supposedly it works just fine. I read some stuff on a few other pages (it's surprising how many Saturn owners use it) and it seems to be good.

It's got a lifetime warranty against breakage, and it's been used in a number of project cars for various magazines (including the ever-trusted Sport Compact Car). Every time I try to find something bad about the PG, I come across people saying "I was ready to say it was junk, but it worked surprisingly well for the price!"

So, for someone like me, who is on a budget, would this be better than blowing $850 of a Quaife that will probably do the same thing?


If anyone has any firsthand experience with the Phantom Grip, I'd love to hear from you! Also, if you can show me any reliable sources of information on it, that would be great!

[Maple50175]

What is it man? Ive never herd if it is it like a tool for ur car? wow i must be dumb

[deevergote]

It's a limited slip differential conversion for the stock open differential. Basically, two plates are insterted into the diff to lock the spider gears during hard acceleration. It is by no means a true LSD, but it's also a fraction of the cost. The idea is so simple that most people dismiss it as crap. The funny thing is that most of the reviews I have found (by people who actually have it installed) say mostly good things.

Supposedly they're not great for really high HP, and not great for road racing or auto-x. I'm pushing no more than 180 to the wheels (215 crank... maybe) and I never race. I plan on dragging in the spring, and I tend to take dark winding roads a little fast, but so far the PG seems good to me.

[HondaFan81]

Aight, I don't have first-hand experience with phantom grip, however I too wondered about it being a cheaper option for an LSD cuz I'll be getting one for my H23 manual trans swap in the far future. Anyhow, I got tired of controversial info I received from peeps so I looked into the design myself. For my needs I decided on Quaife.

However, for what you're looking for it might do the job. I work at Dana Corporation and have some experience with light axles & driveshafts. I've taken apart clutch-type LSDs that are activated hydraulically used in agricultural vehicles. I've also seen physical break-downs on truck/SUV differentials like Trac-Lock, Hydra-Lok and Power-Lok that Dana makes as well as other companies.

Anyhow, like Deevergote said it does use two plates to lock the side gears in the differential. However, he didn't mention it does this by a stiff spring located between the plates. I think they offer two springs rated at 650 & 750 pounds of force. If anyone is familiar with Chrysler products it reminded me of my friends '78 Dodge Magnum that has a Sure-Grip type LSD that uses a similar design by using spring force as well. Anyhow, the force that resists the two CV shafts from differentiating (spinning @ different speeds relative to each other) resides in the spring force...so the more force...the more it resists. However, too much force & you'll take turns with slight wheel hop (like 4x4's).

So what I do not know is an Accord with an H22 swap, how much spring force does it need to do the job right or quite well? If I were you Deevergote, if you go Phantom grip...get the 750 lb spring. Then, let everyone know how it works for ya. Maybe callin them and talking to a Product Engineer, he'd be able to give you an idea based off the flywheel torque ur car is pushin. Call em.

[HondaFan81]

I don't dog the PG design, it will work to some point. That's just it, to what point? If a h22 swapped accord works fine with a PG, I might consider for my project.

However, I'm going into autoX & track racing so I'm going Quaiffe. I figure if Honda has them in their Integra & Civic Type Rs and the NSX and they are designed for just that...why shouldn't I? Also, I like the fact it's mechanical, so in terms of durability if should last for the life of the vehicle assuming it's maintenanced properly & not abused like every other part on ur car. That is my big quarrel with clutch type & spring type LSDs....they will wear out at some point & the more torque the faster it will. You have to buy them accordingly to what ur engine puts out.

[deevergote]

Here's my line of thought at the moment... The stock differential will probably show some wear at high hp after some time using the PG. The Quaiffe would replace the stock differential, right?

So if I were to go with the PG now, and upgrade to the Quaiffe when my diff starts to go, then I should be ok....

[h22sparkle]

I just say pound for pound quaife Ive delt with too much bullshit I just rather have the real thing.

[blazen_accord]

IS the Phantom Grip same as the Custom-fit Limited Slip Differential $299 on JCwhiteney web
does this work on an automatic tranny for F22A??


http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs...mp;appId=204084


CUSTOM-FIT LIMITED SLIP DIFFERENTIAL
The ultimate performance on the street or track?even under full boost!
Smooth power! Maximum traction! Feel the Phantom Grip difference!
Strong, durable and easy to install!
It acts as a disc-type limited slip during corning and braking. Disc plates exert pressure against spider gears using spring pressure to regulate slippage at the wheels. You'll accelerate faster and exit corners at higher speeds. It works as a locker during hard acceleration. Disc plates pivot, locking spiders and causing both wheels to exert equal pressure to the road. Less torque steer than an ordinary differential. Manufacturer's limited lifetime warranty.

[HondaFan81]

If that lil typed up section is what JC Whitney magazine posted, yes it's the same product.

[BustedLX]

Originally posted by h22sparkle
I just say pound for pound quaife Ive delt with too much bullshit I just rather have the real thing.

Real LSD's work on the same principal, This is just basically upgrading your none LSD to LSD.