Science vs Religion

[Gemini]

I'm currently watching a pretty intense intriguing documentary on Showtime title "Expelled: No Intelligence".

Its a engaging documentary where Ben Stein attempts to school viewers on the science vs religion debate between the competing theories of evolution and intelligent design.

This is not to start a debate or anything like that(i dont really care whats your view and where you side on this topic) but to inform anyone thats into stuff like this to check the documentary, its really good. And i just got home from church

[Accord R33]

http://www.expelledexposed.com/

This movie is a load of creationist propaganda. What they did to trick the scientists in this movie into saying what they want you to think they said is just disgusting.

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[Gemini]

http://www.expelledexposed.com/

This movie is a load of creationist propaganda. What they did to trick the scientists in this movie into saying what they want you to think they said is just disgusting.

[/thread]

good to know, i still think the Doc was intriguing

[deevergote]

Any perspective is intriguing. I had a history professor that had the entire class convinced that humans are not made in the image of god, but in the image of angels. Fallen angels. One in particular.

Then he flipped the argument around and convinced us that the existance of god is absolute.

His arguments were compelling. His point was that when you take a point of view and support it, it can be very convincing.




The fact of the matter is, we do not have the ability to prove or disprove the existance of god. Or any other higher power. Or, at this moment anyway, life elsewhere in the universe. We can specualte. We can theorize. We can argue. Based on what we know, and based on our own cogntive ability. However, to assume that we have the ability to understand and explore all options is extremely naive.

All religion is, and all it should be, is a code of conduct (something that all religions share... and bear a striking similarity to each other), and an entertaining excercise in philosophy.

[jdmwannabee]

i think science and faith are complementary. one should not be held in higher regard than the other.
no matter what science advances are made, science will never be able to explain everything, because there are somethings that are simply beyond the scope of our knowledge.

religion might be man made/ manipulated, but faith is an inherent ability in us as people.

[DJ metadelic]

^I concurr. I find that as time goes on, both are starting to be greatly respected in their own rights, most of the people I have conversations with are willing to see science AND religion in the same light, not science VS. religion. Something I've come to respect them for more.

[deevergote]

There is no absolute to either.

[KeeleDesign]

i thought these types of threads were to no longer exzist. as they tare a car community apart instead of unifing them.

[Gemini]

i thought these types of threads were to no longer exzist. as they tare a car community apart instead of unifing them.

Hence the reason why i stated "This is not to start a debate or anything like that(i dont really care whats your view and where you side on this topic) but to inform anyone thats into stuff like this to check the documentary, its really good" in my original posts but it seems I cant control other people's impulses.

[owequitit]

Any perspective is intriguing. I had a history professor that had the entire class convinced that humans are not made in the image of god, but in the image of angels. Fallen angels. One in particular.

Then he flipped the argument around and convinced us that the existance of god is absolute.

His arguments were compelling. His point was that when you take a point of view and support it, it can be very convincing.




The fact of the matter is, we do not have the ability to prove or disprove the existance of god. Or any other higher power. Or, at this moment anyway, life elsewhere in the universe. We can specualte. We can theorize. We can argue. Based on what we know, and based on our own cogntive ability. However, to assume that we have the ability to understand and explore all options is extremely naive.

All religion is, and all it should be, is a code of conduct (something that all religions share... and bear a striking similarity to each other), and an entertaining excercise in philosophy.

Thank you for an intelligent and insightful point of view on the subject. As usual.

Coincidentally, Science and religion frequently compliment each other, when approached with an open mind. From BOTH sides.

[deevergote]

i thought these types of threads were to no longer exzist. as they tare a car community apart instead of unifing them.

Seeing as the majority of the participants have been staff members (or former staff members) that I trust and respect to have an intelligent conversation, I figured I'd leave it be. I trust that any one of them would have the good sense to shut it down if it got out of hand.

What I found interesting was that the first post was Dean, who is religious. The second post was Eric, who believes in nothing. The third was myself, with my usual middle of the road approach.


You're right, these sort of threads usually do make a mess... and I always regret leaving them open. However, I'm always interested to see if this forum has the maturity level to have such a discussion... or at least in seeing how long it will last.

[19dabeast85]

Please don't confuse "religious" with "creationist", there are many religions that have absolutely no creationist base at all. There really aren't that many religions that DO believe in creationism. Just an important technicality.

The fact is that Creationism is just as valid as Evolution from a scientific perspective. The funny thing is that Evolution is a THEORY that is taught in schools as FACT and nobody complains, that irritates me. Diggers have found tons of supposedly "missing links" only to be found out later to be falsified fossil remains in some way. If you don't know this then you don't pay attention to news. The only Evolution we do have proof for is micro-evolution which can happen from gene mutation, extreme diet change, drug abuse, etc. Nobody here will argue with that I don't think. Anyway, I'm not really posting to attack Evolution, just going to support my belief with some real science:

WARNING, this gets deep:

There absolutely is hard scientific proof for Creationism though but you have probably never heard of it because anything of the such gets muted by the media and hardcore pro-evolutionist with power. Laugh if you want. Ever heard of Gerard 't Hooft? He won the Nobel prize in 1999 for his research in particle physics and the development and application of mathematical models that describe the behavior of sub-Planck length "states" that have energy ((EXTREMELY small bits of matter that make up everything)). His research and mathematical models found that these "states" of energy always, without fail operate, move, and respond in a certain, predetermined way. This went against all to-date research in quantum physics which only stated, because nothing had been found yet, how completely uncertain things at the quantum level were (allowing theories such as Evolution to seem possible if the quantum level can change its behavior at random). However, Hooft's models exactly describe and predict the behavior of these very same quantum particulates, removing the uncertainty previously attributed to quantum matter. Any physicist in the world will agree that if the quantum particulates always behave in one certain, predetermined way, then there's no possibility that any kind of Evolution could ever happen because it isn't allowed at the quantum level. Hooft's theories and models have had a number of fully legitimate attempts of disapproval made against them with no luck, so far nobody can disprove his research. You can find an article written about Hooft and some of the mathematicians who tried to disprove him in the May 6th, 2006 issue of NewScientist which is a well respected British science weekly. Look it up and read it before calling me an idiot.

I believe the above to be very solid scientific proof for Intelligent Design/Creationism. I highly doubt anyone here will even bother to look it up though and you'll forget about it in a day, Creationism is too unpopular because nobody wants to believe that they're not in complete control of their own life, even though if Evolution is true you're still not in control, you're slowly turning into some other creature and there's nothing you can do about it!

[texasvtak]

http://www.expelledexposed.com/

This movie is a load of creationist propaganda. What they did to trick the scientists in this movie into saying what they want you to think they said is just disgusting.

[/thread]

Youre so open minde- wait, no, thats not the word I was looking for..

[deevergote]

In order to prove creationism, you have to prove the existance of god. That is not a possibility.

However, a lack of evidence also does not mean that it doesn't exist. We do not have the ability to prove nor disprove the existance of a higher power.

Therefore, EVERYTHING is merely a theory.
And quite honestly, evolution is very well supported. Just because evolution exists doesn't mean that it's not the method of development of a higher power. Saying "god just put us here" is about as good as saying babies come from storks. It's a simplistic explanation of a far more complex concept. If evolution is how we all came about, it does nothing to disprove god.

I'm also keeping god lowercase, because I am not referring to any particular deity. I was raised Catholic, but I'm not naive enough to think that I happen to be among the select few that have chosen the "right" deity to worship. If a god exists, I'm quite sure none of us know exactly who he/she/it is.

[Phempa]

What I think is utterly stupifying is that those of christian faith believe their religion is the correct one.

You do realize that there are 1.5 billion that practice Islam..... anyone here even begin to think that they may be the right ones, and not the christians?


Nope. "MY RELIGION IS THE RIGHT ONE AND EVERYONE ELSE IS WRONG!!!!!!"

How utterly arrogant.

hence my choice to believe in NO religion.