western union

[Xsjado]

is there anyway to control who actually picks up money.
get their information.

why is it the choice of transfer for scammers?

[toycar]

Sure


Depends on how you send it and where. Its been a while, but when I worked out of a bank we handled WU stuff occasionally.


Basically, you either send money to a business or a person. If you send to a person, it is required to have ID unless you put a test question on the transfer, allowing it to be paid out without ID pending the other person having the answer to the test question.



The other way, if you send to a business, no single person picks up the money. Businesses have an account with western union, and everything is trackable.



There are plenty of ways people get fucked on WU transfers though. Say I promise to send you a radio, if you WU me the money.


You send me the money, I never send the radio. What happens next?


Nothing. Its not illegal. WU does not represent a mediator for your financial transactions. If you CHOOSE to send money to someone, that is considered a person to person transfer. Legally, once you sign the form you have acknowledged the transaction as such and are consenting to the payout. The promise of merchandise in return, on a person to person trasnfer, is considered a civil matter in the legal world.


So, you get ripped off, call the cops and they are like,"Its a civil matter, sue" and thats really the end of it. Since the transfer is most likely to another state, jurisdiction comes to play. Your state laws mean dick in the state where the crime was actually committed. You aren't even a citizen of that state, and, its a civil matter at best.

The person can easily argue that reasonable shit came up, and thats why they never sent the item. Its not illegal, its a civil matter. Sure you could sue and win in court. Good luck with that though.



So, you send money WU, they legally don't have to send your merchandise. Theres no legal agreement stating that they have to pending that transfer. Most people think that since they used WU they will be protected. All WU does is transfer money. They do not have anything to do with any purchase.

[Xsjado]

great answer.

does paypal give transfer protection.

what if it is for a good rather than money what should be used?

[toycar]

great answer.

does paypal give transfer protection.

what if it is for a good rather than money what should be used?

Paypal does offer protection, however it is limited. They can revoke the payment, as long as the money is still sitting in the persons account. If the person takes the money and never has another transfer into that account, theres not much that paypal can do about it.

They do however provide the legal means of being the middle man in a transaction that was specifically for goods. So, when you do not get the goods its no longer just a civil matter. Its not just your word against theirs anymore.


It is now considered theft by deception because of the arranged payment for goods situation and how it is documented. Its all documented when you purchase something and then pay through paypal.

You can also gift money through paypal. If someone asks you to do that, that should be a flag that something might not be right. Plenty of peolple offer it, and then say "or you can add 3% for paypal fee's" and then I usually trust that.


If you send the money as a gift, legally, that is how it is interpreted. People that scam know this, and so often people will only accept payments as gifts because of the legal side of how that is interpreted. Totally different and thats why paypal words it that way. Its a liability issue in the legal technical jargon world. If you gift someone something, and then regret it, you don't legally have a leg to stand on.


If you pay for something, and never get your goods, thats totally different. Scams are playing that fine line to swindle people.





Just like the secret shopper scams.


They send out like 100,000 checks to "selected people for secret shopping"


Those people try and cash checks for like $3300 and the check is attached to a detailed letter of how to "secret shop" and basically do their job. The idea here is that some people will have $3300 in the bank. Those people will get paid on the spot for the check, when they deposit it. If you don't have the money, the bank puts a hold on the check until it clears. If you do have the money, they still put a hold on the check they just use your personal money as collateral.


Anyways, per the instructions you cash this check and then send like $2800 to some name, in some country. Pay the $120 or so in fees, and then review your service. Keep the extra $380 as your pay.


Sounds attractive right? So the idea behind the scam is that some people will get that money the day they go to the bank and actually send the transfer, feeling like they just made an easy $380.

The person picks up the transfer, and Muahahahahaha's their happy ass away from the customer service desk.


3-5 business days later the check bounces, and the bank takes YOUR money that they used as collateral. Now you are out $3300, and the "person to person" transfer holds no liability.


Its not a crime to pick up the money. The "secret shopper" willingly sent the money, and signed the consent form.


SCAMS baby. I know lots of them. I have worked with money for a decade or so, pretty familiar with most of the scams.

[BurtonRiderT6]

Apparently you have never seen the movie Due Date. Great example of how Western Union works.

[Sordz]

for WU the person you send the money to also has to know your name or the name given, I send western unions oversea a couple times a month and one time the lady decided to add the initial to my middle name on the transaction. The person I sent the money to was unable to pick it up until I realized that and told them.

Paypal is safer because you can file a complaint within a certain time period and they will hold the money from the account. If you gift money through paypal I dont believe you can open a case, but there also wont be a fee to receive the money and you wont have to pay sales tax on it at the end of the year.

[Ralphie]

In regards to Paypal, if they can't "pull" the money back from the scamming account, then they will charge that account for the ammount, basically making the account (-).

In order to use that account again, you have to refund the amount charged or else it is locked and then sent to a collections agency.

Be careful

[MikeW]

Ive sent WU a number of times and I've always had up-to-minute contact with the people I send to. Either via text or on the phone with them. If you're that worried, make the secret question a series of numbers and letters and then text/email it to them.

I've only had one issue, most recently where someone was supposed to send me money and I never got it. The sender said they sent it and had receipt on their end but WU didn't have record of it. I don't think that was a WU thing though, I think the sender was lying to me.