mondojackal : 1991 240SX SE

[owequitit]

I have a fast street car, in a straight line, and around corners. My friend has a fast street car, but only in a straight line. Try turning a corner at a high rate of speed and prepare to die.

Define fast street car and we'll go from there.

Jackal has the right idea, make a well balanced car, make it fun to drive blah blah blah.

John Force once said something to this effect, when speaking of Formula 1 racing.

Going 300MPH is one thing. Going 300MPH and then turning left is a whole nother ball game.

It isn't an exact quote, but you get the idea.

[mondojackal]

Why would you build one of these cars for drag racing.... its just beyond me..

granted, but his purpose is 3-fold, i think.
1-to show that the KA is just as capable, if not more so, than the SR
2-to show that the S-chassis is capable of more than just drifting and autoX
3-to provide support for other people modding the KA. Ivan pretty much made KA-T.org by himself, opening the door for so many other people to have KA's. (kinda like #1, but i think it's different enough)

He said he wants a fast street car. I think that would be a bad azz street car

thanks man! me too!

I have a fast street car, in a straight line, and around corners. My friend has a fast street car, but only in a straight line. Try turning a corner at a high rate of speed and prepare to die.

Define fast street car and we'll go from there.

Jackal has the right idea, make a well balanced car, make it fun to drive blah blah blah.

that's the idea. i dont really track the car, (not saying that i wont, cause that's like getting 3 scoops of ice cream, and then watching them melt all over your hand) but by keeping it as well rounded as possible (good basis of suspension and trackability, turbo for obviously better acceleration, mid size turbo for big power, but not so big that lag becomes an apparent issue at an autoX or circuit event, etc.)
trust me, after seeing what the simple suspension setup on my accord would allow me to do above a stock accord, and seeing how the 240 handles much better than my accord ever did, i'm more than excited about modding the suspension of my car. the thing about corners is that they can hardly get you a ticket for taking them a bit to fast.

[owequitit]

granted, but his purpose is 3-fold, i think.
1-to show that the KA is just as capable, if not more so, than the SR
2-to show that the S-chassis is capable of more than just drifting and autoX
3-to provide support for other people modding the KA. Ivan pretty much made KA-T.org by himself, opening the door for so many other people to have KA's. (kinda like #1, but i think it's different enough)

thanks man! me too!

that's the idea. i dont really track the car, (not saying that i wont, cause that's like getting 3 scoops of ice cream, and then watching them melt all over your hand) but by keeping it as well rounded as possible (good basis of suspension and trackability, turbo for obviously better acceleration, mid size turbo for big power, but not so big that lag becomes an apparent issue at an autoX or circuit event, etc.)
trust me, after seeing what the simple suspension setup on my accord would allow me to do above a stock accord, and seeing how the 240 handles much better than my accord ever did, i'm more than excited about modding the suspension of my car. the thing about corners is that they can hardly get you a ticket for taking them a bit to fast.

Just be careful, the Accord was calibrated to be softer, so there was naturally more headroom. If I remember correctly, the 240 doesn't have tons of travel.

[mondojackal]

Just be careful, the Accord was calibrated to be softer, so there was naturally more headroom. If I remember correctly, the 240 doesn't have tons of travel.

yeah, figured that one out already. i live with my sister over the summer, cause im not away at college and dont wanna move back in with my parents. well, they dont have a driveway, so we park in the yard. well...lemme just say that's one heck of a rough ride just in and out the yard. the 240 doesnt like bumps very much. plus i dont have much tire sidewall. the front springs are huge. literally, they're like 6in in diameter, or close to it. and, like you said, they're really short.

[Dv8]

Just be careful, the Accord was calibrated to be softer, so there was naturally more headroom. If I remember correctly, the 240 doesn't have tons of travel.

Less than tonnes. The lower you go, the more you rely on tires for give lol.

Dont expect to be the least bit comfortable in this car with stiff suspension.

If you do decide to slam it, or have it reasonably low make sure you use 8 kilogram springs or more or the frame will meet the ground more often than not. I have that problem, I have 8 kilo springs that are preloaded a LOT, but I also have an iron torpedo that they have to deal with. Fucking iron.

[owequitit]

yeah, figured that one out already. i live with my sister over the summer, cause im not away at college and dont wanna move back in with my parents. well, they dont have a driveway, so we park in the yard. well...lemme just say that's one heck of a rough ride just in and out the yard. the 240 doesnt like bumps very much. plus i dont have much tire sidewall. the front springs are huge. literally, they're like 6in in diameter, or close to it. and, like you said, they're really short.

As long as you stiffen the springs without lowering it much, you should be OK. It just reminds me of people who used to have Neons. They would lower the crap out of them, and then wonder why they handled badly. It was mostly because they had no travel to begin with. A car on the bumpstops is not a good handling car.

A lot of the older Nissans were similar, and for whatever reason, Nissan didn't equip them with a lot of travel, so the route in which you have to attack it is slightly different.

Honestly, Honda's get derided for a lot of things, but one thing that I think is fairly obvious about them, is that their suspension is incredibly easy to tune, and make more effective. Stock, they have TONS of travel. With EG Civics, you can drop them almost 3" and STILL have decent travel, whereas some other cars don't even have 3" to start with. They also have sophisticated layout, that helps them grip when they are lowered, or even stock.

I am not saying you can't get the 240 to handle well, but don't assume that just because your Accord responded a certain way with minor suspension mods, that the 'ssan will be the same. Honda's have an uncanny response to suspension mods. Hell, with minor parts, a CB7 will handle with an M3.

Also, even though it might not "look" as cool, just try to avoid lowering it much, and you should be fine. It might not have a terrific ride/handling trade off, but I think you will still be happy.

[mondojackal]

i appreciate the advice, scott.

on another note, i went to the local car meet/show. saw beat up 240 with bigass drag radials on it. saw FMIC. said to self "hella sleeper"
went over, chatted it up with the guy. RB20. 16psi. stock block. small N2O shot.

well, i went up, and, thinking of DV8 the whole time started talking about how the RB20 is underrated, and the guy's face just lit up, and he was like "you know, you're the first person who's said that to me tonight!"
and we got to talking about how the KA's and the RB20's are underrated, and really are MUCH more capable than anyone gives them credit for. well, after talking for about an hour, he starts asking about racing action, since he's not from pensacola, but is actually from destin, which is a little over an hour away.
so i tell him that we usually race on the interstate at here, here and here. and he gets excited and starts going around asking for races. lol.
i just thought the guy was being ridiculous, cause he headed right for some of the big guns out there. turbo 94-98 cobra, supercharged NSX, supercharged 99-04 GT.
well, the nsx didnt wanna run, and the cobra was leaving, so he goes to the GT and asks for a run; the guy in the GT complies, so we all pile into our cars and head for the interstate. we get on the interstate, and they line up about 35-ish. the 240 is running open DP, so the spool is freakin loud. well, they line up, wait for traffic to clear, and hit it. 240 has just a little bit of lag, and starts to pull off really hard. the GT pulls up even with the 240, and then he shifts, and when he hits the next gear, his back tires break loose and his car goes all over the road. pretty sweet. so the 240 pulls ahead on the GT, prolly about 1.5-2 car lengths to about 100-110 or so. i was duly impressed with the 240, i expected it to be fast, but not that fast. well, we cruise back by the meet/show and we all pull in there in a little group. the GT guy gets out, and was like "yeah, i'll give it to ya. that thing is fuckin fast!!" lol
so they get to talking, and the guy with the 240 pops his hood and shows what he's got. then the stang guy starts with his setup.
well, before the race, he wouldnt say what he had done. turns out he's supercharged (but you already know that now). he's running a fully forged bottom end with a vortech supercharger at 12psi. they got to talking about times, and the guy with the GT had hihs best 1/8th run at 7.98, making it a low 12's car, maybe high 11's on a good day, if i had to guess.
needless to say i was pretty impressed with the RB20 in that 240.

CliffsNotes:
car meet. saw a RB20'd 240 (16lbs boost). talked with the guy. got him to run a 99-04 mustang GT with a vortech supercharger @ 12psi. 240 pulls 2 cars on GT from 35-105-ish. nathan was impressed.

[mondojackal]

Less than tonnes. The lower you go, the more you rely on tires for give lol.

Dont expect to be the least bit comfortable in this car with stiff suspension.

If you do decide to slam it, or have it reasonably low make sure you use 8 kilogram springs or more or the frame will meet the ground more often than not. I have that problem, I have 8 kilo springs that are preloaded a LOT, but I also have an iron torpedo that they have to deal with. Fucking iron.

yeah, it's already not comfortable at all, and it makes all sorts of noise over rough surfaces, but it's all good. it really doesnt bother me unless some dumb girl is riding with me, and she's like "what's that noise??"

[mondojackal]

i've been looking more and more at engine management lately, and i wanted to get owequitit and DV8's and oozingmachismo's opinions on such.
im thinking megasquirt is an option, just because it's inexpensive, although more work IS involved. also, i've thought about using an SAFC and a JWT ECU, but that doesnt really seem the best option to me.
i guess what im asking is. what do you guys think of a piggyback such as greddy e-manage ultimate vs. a full standalone such as an apex PowerFC, or AEM EMS??

[owequitit]

i've been looking more and more at engine management lately, and i wanted to get owequitit and DV8's and oozingmachismo's opinions on such.
im thinking megasquirt is an option, just because it's inexpensive, although more work IS involved. also, i've thought about using an SAFC and a JWT ECU, but that doesnt really seem the best option to me.
i guess what im asking is. what do you guys think of a piggyback such as greddy e-manage ultimate vs. a full standalone such as an apex PowerFC, or AEM EMS??

I am not as familiar with Nissan solutions, but I know that I have never heard anything bad about JWT. Megasquirt is also quite the setup apparently, although I haven't dealt with it. Grassroots Motorsports seems to really like it.

Personally, if you are going full boosted in a DD, I would try and go for standalone, with as much adjustability as you can get. It will make it easier to not have to sacrifice reliability, or drivability, and will still allow you to extract the maximum potential. In my opinion.

[Dv8]

I dont even know if you can use powerFC on KA's, but if you can, use it.. The only thing that I can think of thats better is the new AEM EMS, but its REALLY expencive.

[d112crzy]

Personally, if you are going full boosted in a DD, I would try and go for standalone, with as much adjustability as you can get. It will make it easier to not have to sacrifice reliability, or drivability, and will still allow you to extract the maximum potential. In my opinion.

I'd recommend this only if you're boosting an insane amount and want to keep it DD.
AEM has WAY too many options that not even a lot of the super boosted cars use. It has lots of things to mess with, most that you probably won't use.

MegaSquirt is an awesome tuning program. It's a bitch to get setup tho.

Start doing some research on it. Find someone that has installed MS before. It's a huge project of a beginner.

[King James]

How good of milage do you get with this thing?....I REALLY want a 240...but gas is a factor with me since I do alot of driving.

[mondojackal]

How good of milage do you get with this thing?....I REALLY want a 240...but gas is a factor with me since I do alot of driving.

stock 2.4 liter motor with an automatic, i get 23mpg in the city, driving to work and back. and i havent really checked it on the highway, but it'll get pretty good mileage during the day. (the pop-up headlights kinda act like air brakes at night..lol)
oh, and i dont use my A/C, so that's prolly worth 1-2mpg. get one..it's a great car, and you won't regret it.

[mondojackal]

I am not as familiar with Nissan solutions, but I know that I have never heard anything bad about JWT. Megasquirt is also quite the setup apparently, although I haven't dealt with it. Grassroots Motorsports seems to really like it.

Personally, if you are going full boosted in a DD, I would try and go for standalone, with as much adjustability as you can get. It will make it easier to not have to sacrifice reliability, or drivability, and will still allow you to extract the maximum potential. In my opinion.

well, i think that AEM seems to be the best option, but the price sucks..
megasquirt, on their site, is said to be a "stand-alone" but really it's just a ROM tuning system. I've checked it out, and it looks pretty good, but, as Jose mentioned, it's a difficult install. so i'll prolly get a guy i know at a local shop to install it if i indeed choose that route.

I dont even know if you can use powerFC on KA's, but if you can, use it.. The only thing that I can think of thats better is the new AEM EMS, but its REALLY expencive.

i think you're right about it not working on KA's. i checked the listing, and the KA wasn't on the page, but i thought that that might have been a shorter, non-complete listing, since the KA isnt a very popular platform to begin with.

I'd recommend this only if you're boosting an insane amount and want to keep it DD.
AEM has WAY too many options that not even a lot of the super boosted cars use. It has lots of things to mess with, most that you probably won't use.

MegaSquirt is an awesome tuning program. It's a bitch to get setup tho.

Start doing some research on it. Find someone that has installed MS before. It's a huge project of a beginner.

15psi on a built block, maybe higher, depends on how things turn out. i dont think i need an AEM EMS, either.

thanks to everyone for their responses. i appreciate the insight.

what do you guys think would be the pros and cons of using a JWT ECU and using an AFC of some sort?