New Engine Management Setup

[MRX]

Well guys, my boost project is being held back again...yes i know i said that 3 months ago...then 2 months ago...last month and so on but get over it lol Ok heres the deal, i've been watching and researching many boosted f22's and trying to figure out why they keep blowing up. I'm convinced it has to do with the engine and fuel management. I'd acquired 1g dsm 450cc injectors, an AEM fuel pressure regulator, the walbro 255lph fuel pump, and the Apex'i SAFC but my setup is the same as 3 other boosted f22's that are no longer running because the engine blew.

So i was napa yesterday and ran into this Stephen kid who boosted a LS engine. He asked what management i was using i told him my setup in the above order and when i got to the SAFC he cringed and suggested i do what he and many others have done...no not a fmu...chip the ecu and run it on custom fuel and ignition maps. I have been very interested in running a chipped ecu but wanted to keep my IAB function and didn't feel that i would have the knowledge as of yet to customize the maps or get everything hooked up correctly. But after doing alot of research i've decided to ditch the safc and run a chipped p28 ecu on uberdata and ecucontrol for datalogging.

Uberdata will allow me to change any aspect of the a/f ratio, ignition timing, allows full throttle launches and shifts, and some other very useful features are included as well. I've seen wideband dyno's where ppl have been able to get their a/f ratios between 11.7:1-12.0:1 throughout the ENTIRE powerband. Its basically like a free hondata unit but not so well known. The reason i'm ditching the safc is because of the way it adds fuel. It adds fuel by shrinking the ignition maps thus advances the timing. Too many boosted f's have blown up and i don't want to be one of them.

I'll do a diy on all the parts as well as the other aspects of my turbo project. I may even buy a cheapo laptop (if anybody is selling one lemme know) so i can burn new maps inside my car as i please. Fully adjustable engine management, decent fuel delivery, and correct cam timing will have this engine running marvelously. We already know the car will be fast but with this major change it stands a much better chance of lasting...as for costs...the safc cost me about $190 (which i'm going to sell)...uberdata is free, the various connections to the ecu from the laptop will be about $30, p28 ecu $50, chipping parts are $20, EcuControl is free, so i'll make back about $90 at the moment

[SoySauceCb7]

umm sounds great good luck

[d21x]

HOLLY SHIT SOMEONE HAS FINALLY GOT IT RIGHT!!!!!!!

I've been saying it over and over and over, but no one understands that the safc/vafc advances timing when it adds fuel!!!

You're a 5speed right??? Chipped ecu's on our auto tranny's dont work because of the TCU.

You're also a nonvtec engine right??? if so why dont u use the nonvtec civic ecu??? Because nonvtec ECU's are cheaper and you dont need the vtec.

If you plan to use a Wideband O2 sensor, you should checkout http://www.diy-wb.com/
This website also has a link to dataloggint equipment so you can checkout your A/F ratio.

I'd sell you my laptop that i got for doing a turbo, but i got too good of a deal to let it go.

GOODLUCK!!!!!

[AznBadAss92LX]

im runnin turbo soon...and i got the afc hack...but im contemplating retarding the timing using a universal btm or just doing it in the distrib

[WiKKeDV16]

that sounds nice and all aznbadass.. but the fact that u cant tune your car at stock timing setting(dizzy side) will hinder performance.... and if u ever desided to up the boost u have to retard even more.. thus making a very unefficient car.. it will still make power,run alright... but.. when it comes to linear powerband.. bleh.. alot of dyno tuning will be in order.. and even then you wont be able to compete with the uberdata setup

gawd for the past few months ive been on and off with uberdata and crome.. and tuners of the like.. and then.. about 2 weeks ago.. antoine made me get the bug again.. so i started doing maps again.. and now im back into this shit.. GRRRRR hahaha

well he/i will keep u posted on whatever is done...

toine(not trying to thread jack)

back to uberdata... like hes already mentioned... you can tune every perameter of the matrix of your fuel/ignition maps
and i do mean everything
from partial throttle/wot/preferences when i say preferences i mean like..antoine for example....drives daily his cb7 and shifts between 2-3k.. so he wanted from 1-3k to be very fuel efficient but still not hinder power
from 3-4k slightly more aggressive and from 4-6k ownage..

think about it when racing.. u DO need a nice linear powerband to get up their to 6k but where do u spend ur time at??
4-6k so thats where power will be made the most.. when racing..
anyhoot.. all im saying is.. to look into it.. not directed at anyone in specific just.. whoever reads this..
Yes it is at first a pain to understand
Yes its not something u can pick up in 1 day takes months
Yes it costs the same as a safc or around the same
yes you can tune your car as if you were on the dyno
etc..
ok im done with my ranting

[ZigenBallZ]

Originally posted by WiKKeDV16
that sounds nice and all aznbadass.. but the fact that u cant tune your car at stock timing setting(dizzy side) will hinder performance.... and if u ever desided to up the boost u have to retard even more.. thus making a very unefficient car.. it will still make power,run alright... but.. when it comes to linear powerband.. bleh.. alot of dyno tuning will be in order.. and even then you wont be able to compete with the uberdata setup

gawd for the past few months ive been on and off with uberdata and crome.. and tuners of the like.. and then.. about 2 weeks ago.. antoine made me get the bug again.. so i started doing maps again.. and now im back into this shit.. GRRRRR hahaha

well he/i will keep u posted on whatever is done...

toine(not trying to thread jack)

back to uberdata... like hes already mentioned... you can tune every perameter of the matrix of your fuel/ignition maps
and i do mean everything
from partial throttle/wot/preferences when i say preferences i mean like..antoine for example....drives daily his cb7 and shifts between 2-3k.. so he wanted from 1-3k to be very fuel efficient but still not hinder power
from 3-4k slightly more aggressive and from 4-6k ownage..

think about it when racing.. u DO need a nice linear powerband to get up their to 6k but where do u spend ur time at??
4-6k so thats where power will be made the most.. when racing..
anyhoot.. all im saying is.. to look into it.. not directed at anyone in specific just.. whoever reads this..
Yes it is at first a pain to understand
Yes its not something u can pick up in 1 day takes months
Yes it costs the same as a safc or around the same
yes you can tune your car as if you were on the dyno
etc..
ok im done with my ranting

[BustedLX]

I don't know where you plan to buy a P28 for $50 but I wish you luck on your quest.

You should run a PR4, P74, or a P75. They are all none Vtec ECU's and now with the rom dumps for the F22Ax available on the net you should be able to port them over easily. Then add boost and set your parameters.

When it comes to tuning roms for Civic's (P28, P06, P05) I always have trouble with Uberdata. I've found Crome to be better for tuning Civic's however Crome can't acurately tune an Integra rom to save it's life.

If you are going to run Uberdata which is a great program run an Integra ECU like I said above a PR4 or P74. They are normally cheaper and easier to find since they come out of the base Integra LS.

This is a cheaper, better alternative for engine management. I'm glad you finally saw the light.

[MRX]

preciate the replies guys. The p28 is local i just need to get ahold of the guy selling it. It is a 5-speed ecu and all so i don't have to worry about tcu's. This is a non-vtec f22a series engine and the reason i'm using the p28 is because we already have roms for it and i have a firm belief (after much research) that the p28 can operate my dual runner intake mani. So if it doesn't then oh well. I'm not worried at all about running a vtec ecu on a non vtec car if all the parameters are going to be changed anyways, besides vtec can easily be turned off I've also read up and noticed that the p28 seems to be a little easier to work with for some reason or another. Wikked makes the base maps (we have 3 now) in uberdata, transfers them to Crome to smooth then out and do some fine tuning, and imports the rom back to uberdata. So technically we're using Crome and Uberdata but the eproms will be burned with the uberdata code.

I do plan on getting a wideband in the next 2-3 months but for now it'll just be dyno tuned until i'm running a 12.0-12.3 a/f ratio just to basically compensate for changes in air intake temperature. I just bought a laptop today, a power inverter, and downloaded ecucontrol, and uberdata. My chipping parts should be here soon and my eprom programmer will be here sometime next week.

[BustedLX]

My only advice to you is get on pgmfi.org and read. Search and read, don't post, just search and read. You will find that allot of your questions have answers and you will here what others are doing.

Personally in my experiance the recommendation I gave you is the EASIEST route. Sure you can run a non-Vtec engine with a Vtec ECU. Yeah you can dissable Vtec but why? Why would you want to add more information into the rom that could accidentally corrupt it. Do you like driving around with a CEL?

Just do the work in Uberdata. Use Integra roms with an Integra ECU and change the appropriate information. You'll see how easy it is and how well the engine responds.

[MRX]

Originally posted by BustedLX
My only advice to you is get on pgmfi.org and read. Search and read, don't post, just search and read. You will find that allot of your questions have answers and you will here what others are doing.

Personally in my experiance the recommendation I gave you is the EASIEST route. Sure you can run a non-Vtec engine with a Vtec ECU. Yeah you can dissable Vtec but why? Why would you want to add more information into the rom that could accidentally corrupt it. Do you like driving around with a CEL?

Just do the work in Uberdata. Use Integra roms with an Integra ECU and change the appropriate information. You'll see how easy it is and how well the engine responds.

don't worry i'm all over it i'm reading up everyday (never posting) and have been for about 3 weeks now. I'll take everything u've said into consideration also

[Accord R33]

Iv been doing the same thing as you Midnight. only iv been doing it on and off for about the past year now.

How are you and wicked creating those base maps? where are you pulling the numbers from?

anyway. my p06 ecu should be here friday so i can start chipping it. If wicked would be so kind as to send those base maps to me I can test them out and tell you guys what happens. im looking for a nice base map anyway.

[Accord R33]

While we are on this subject...How will a JDM p06 work with the accord anyway as far as IAB, EGT, and all that good stuff? would i be better off getting a different ECU? i got this one for pretty much nothing so i want to use it if i can.

[WiKKeDV16]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Accord R33
[B]Iv been doing the same thing as you Midnight. only iv been doing it on and off for about the past year now.

How are you and wicked creating those base maps? where are you pulling the numbers from?

basiclly..using gimpys old bins.. his f22b1/a1/ maps.. umm. i think we got another one off of someone from uberdatas website.. there just scattered.. gimps shit was rich as hell.. so i decreased the fuel.. and they look better.. also showed them to zigen and he gave his imput and i corrected it but kept the original

right now we have around 4 basemaps to play with.. and well see which one leads us in the right direction the quickest..


r33 hit me up on AIM wikkedv15 and ill send em to you..

[HondaFan81]

Now this is a sweet thread. I've been planning on doing this type of setup for my all-motor build-up. I just haven't reached this point in my project yet, but this summer I want to hit it harder with the change in my college plans, etc.

I have a general knowledge on this, but i want to fill my head with all the info I'll need.

I have a P06 ECU for manual trans. and would like IAB capability as well. I have Crome downloaded on my laptop, we have a power inverter, guess I should get going on the rest. I'll have to do my share of research ...

I think all this will be like the ultimate video game This is what tuning your car is about man. I'm glad to see there is a few of you here going this route or are knowledgeable on it.

[Accord R33]

im not completely sure anyone has sucessfully added IAB to a p06 ECU. i would use the P72 which already has it.

BTW: welcome to the club