Questions regarding FWD and snow driving....

[Ralphie]

Well as much as I hate to admit it, I spun out 3 fucking times this morning on my way to work. The road I take primarily for work is two lanes, one each direction. It's mostly rural and the speed limit varies from 35-50. Mostly 50.

Ok so the first time-
Traveling alone, going about 30...keeping up with traffic...leaving boat loads of room in front of me...like 7 cars or so length.
This lady up ahead is stopped to make a left and Id have to either wait or pass on the shoulder....so im beginning to slow down...light braking...
the roads are slushy for the most part... I start to feel the car slide in the front...didn't really react fast enough and I slide into oncomming traffic....an X5 lol...thankfully he went around me with his Awd and kept on going and I slid around going the opposite direction and stopped.....facing the opposite way but in the correct lane you know?
So I turn around and continue on...


2nd time-Hyundai is up my fucking ass and I have a red light coming up......so I need to slow down and stop but Im worried about asshole behind me...
so as im slowing down the rear end slides out(which is weird no?) and I slide all the way around again facing the opposite direction in the opposite lane.
Ok so now im fucking scared and pissed off lol. So the majority of the way im good..

3rd time-This was more controlled...im going down the last two lane rd of my commute...in the opposite lane there is like a motorcade of cars going like 10mph....so im like well it must be real bad up ahead...im doing like 25-30...so i let off the gas...give it NO BRAKE...just take my foot off the gas....and it starts to slide in the front again....so this time I know if I slide left im hitting 4 or 5 cars EASY....so I jerk to the right and slide into a ditch but since it has snow I regain traction and pull back out onto the road...and continue on with no issues....all in all the coupe has not one scratch....she is good to go....could have been REAL fucking bad.


So im pretty embarrased...I consider myself a good driver...just never really dealt with REAL snow/slush driving....doing 90% of my driving in Fla/Ga...I can drive for miles in the rain, i've hydroplanned and never slid out because i know how to drive and deal with water...
this fucking snow shit is crazy.I know I should maybe have been driving a little slower...but I mean if it's a 50 and im doing 30 that's not to fast...
Maybe it is....I don't know....but it wasn't happening while I was driving....all 3 were trying to stop....
so I guess im looking for the old timers with lots of snow driving experience to give some tips for driving with a fwd car in this shit.
I've read online and heard that when it starts to slide you don't brake, just steer in the direction you want to go and give it slight slight gas to keep it headed that way...
but these events I had like 0 control...shit was legit sliding like on ice...the only one I had time to react was the 3rd one...

So flame suit on, by all means.
I want to learn from it...I already figured maybe going slower....but I also read that when you go slower, the motor is turning slower, so there is more tq....so it kind of increases the chance of sliding, especially under the weight of the car...
so idk a lot of good info and a lof of bs floating around...
also I was looking into AWD and traction control...
I remember hearing that AWD only helps you from a dead stop....once moving it does nothing...
but traction control is what you need for these types of incidents....
so should I be looking to invest in one or both with my next car?????

Any advice is good advice!

Thanks!

[toycar]

Disregard speed limits when snow driving. Unplowed road, keep it 25 and under.
Sloshy kinda snow, even slower. It's the dry powdery stuff that's easiest to drive on.

New tires are your friend. Brake twice and slow as normal. If everyone else is going 10mph, go 10mph too.

5 spd pwns auto.

Steer through sliding rather than correct. Corrective steering spins the car around. Starts feeling slick, let off gas entirely and steer through it. No brakes allowed when sliding. Total no-no.

Trying to think what else. Driving in the shitty snow should be a sport. Super fun if you are good at it, scary as fuck if not.

I pwn the snow in my awd dsm. Hitting corners at 20mph sideways, spinning all 4 tires. Complete fucking blast

[oyajicool]

Width and grooves of tires may have something to do with you spinning than your ability to control the car.

[Ralphie]

Disregard speed limits when snow driving. Unplowed road, keep it 25 and under.
Sloshy kinda snow, even slower. It's the dry powdery stuff that's easiest to drive on.

New tires are your friend. Brake twice and slow as normal. If everyone else is going 10mph, go 10mph too.

5 spd pwns auto.

Steer through sliding rather than correct. Corrective steering spins the car around. Starts feeling slick, let off gas entirely and steer through it. No brakes allowed when sliding. Total no-no.

Trying to think what else. Driving in the shitty snow should be a sport. Super fun if you are good at it, scary as fuck if not.

I pwn the snow in my awd dsm. Hitting corners at 20mph sideways, spinning all 4 tires. Complete fucking blast

Hm so yea I probably should have been going slower...but the first part of my commute 'felt' ok, so it was deceiving and other people were traveling about 30.

It seemed slow enough to me to react but I was wrong.

I def need tires, im sure of that. That probably had a lot to do with it.

I won't be getting 5SPD anytime soon, so that's out.

Ya I hit the brakes ever so slightly in one of the instances, and knew immediately I fucked up lol.

Width and grooves of tires may have something to do with you spinning than your ability to control the car.

Ya it's probably 90% tires and 10% me.

[Accrdwgnguy]

What tires do you have?

This is the first snow season I do not have snow tires on my car. I have performance all-seasons, and I have zero grip in snow. Its scary. With snow tires the Accord is king of the road.

[oni_cb7]

What tires do you have?

This is the first snow season I do not have snow tires on my car. I have performance all-seasons, and I have zero grip in snow. Its scary. With snow tires the Accord is king of the road.

Well that's because all-seasons aren't really geared toward snow driving, but a balance between all types. This causes the tire to lack in performance in certain types of weather. If it is heavy snow, then you need snow tires (maybe some chains on the car, surprised it wasn't mentioned yet). If it is a light snow that barely covers the ground, then all-season tires should be fine. I wouldn't risk it though. That's why some people have winter rims, not to save their summer rims, but to keep snow tires on the winter rims and not have to worry about getting new tires mounted.

[gloryaccordy]

Tires are your buddy. I had my last Accord through the blizzard of 2010 on new tires, slammed and everything. Never spun or got stuck once.

[Sordz]

Does your car have ABS? I would choose ABS over awd or traction control, but there all very nice to have.

Get tires if you need them, no need to get hurt or hurt someone else. Lastly I would suggest finding a large parking lot with snow and no cars and practice turning and stopping so you can learn how the car drives in those conditions.

[oni_cb7]

Does anyone use these anymore....?

Yeah they can scratch up the rims, but its better than spinning out some more.

[mtnbikaah]

I have these back in MA on some steelies. General Altimax Arctic, 185/70R15.. The narrower the better for snow tires (within reason of course).

Drive slowly, and make every action smooth (shifting, braking, accelerating, turning, everything.)

Even Subarus suck in the snow if they have crappy tires.

[owequitit]

Well as much as I hate to admit it, I spun out 3 fucking times this morning on my way to work. The road I take primarily for work is two lanes, one each direction. It's mostly rural and the speed limit varies from 35-50. Mostly 50.

Ok so the first time-
Traveling alone, going about 30...keeping up with traffic...leaving boat loads of room in front of me...like 7 cars or so length.
This lady up ahead is stopped to make a left and Id have to either wait or pass on the shoulder....so im beginning to slow down...light braking...
the roads are slushy for the most part... I start to feel the car slide in the front...didn't really react fast enough and I slide into oncomming traffic....an X5 lol...thankfully he went around me with his Awd and kept on going and I slid around going the opposite direction and stopped.....facing the opposite way but in the correct lane you know?
So I turn around and continue on...


2nd time-Hyundai is up my fucking ass and I have a red light coming up......so I need to slow down and stop but Im worried about asshole behind me...
so as im slowing down the rear end slides out(which is weird no?) and I slide all the way around again facing the opposite direction in the opposite lane.
Ok so now im fucking scared and pissed off lol. So the majority of the way im good..

3rd time-This was more controlled...im going down the last two lane rd of my commute...in the opposite lane there is like a motorcade of cars going like 10mph....so im like well it must be real bad up ahead...im doing like 25-30...so i let off the gas...give it NO BRAKE...just take my foot off the gas....and it starts to slide in the front again....so this time I know if I slide left im hitting 4 or 5 cars EASY....so I jerk to the right and slide into a ditch but since it has snow I regain traction and pull back out onto the road...and continue on with no issues....all in all the coupe has not one scratch....she is good to go....could have been REAL fucking bad.


So im pretty embarrased...I consider myself a good driver...just never really dealt with REAL snow/slush driving....doing 90% of my driving in Fla/Ga...I can drive for miles in the rain, i've hydroplanned and never slid out because i know how to drive and deal with water...
this fucking snow shit is crazy.I know I should maybe have been driving a little slower...but I mean if it's a 50 and im doing 30 that's not to fast...
Maybe it is....I don't know....but it wasn't happening while I was driving....all 3 were trying to stop....
so I guess im looking for the old timers with lots of snow driving experience to give some tips for driving with a fwd car in this shit.
I've read online and heard that when it starts to slide you don't brake, just steer in the direction you want to go and give it slight slight gas to keep it headed that way...
but these events I had like 0 control...shit was legit sliding like on ice...the only one I had time to react was the 3rd one...

So flame suit on, by all means.
I want to learn from it...I already figured maybe going slower....but I also read that when you go slower, the motor is turning slower, so there is more tq....so it kind of increases the chance of sliding, especially under the weight of the car...
so idk a lot of good info and a lof of bs floating around...
also I was looking into AWD and traction control...
I remember hearing that AWD only helps you from a dead stop....once moving it does nothing...
but traction control is what you need for these types of incidents....
so should I be looking to invest in one or both with my next car?????

Any advice is good advice!

Thanks!

1) If you lose control, you are going too fast. It doesn't matter what the speed limit is. Also, road conditions change based on local weather, friction surface, grade etc. It is not uncommon for us to have a myriad of road qualities in a few miles out here, because even 100-200 feet can make a world of difference.

I once had to do 25 on the interstate with a speed limit of 75 because that was the maximum speed at which I could maintain control of the car.

Pretty much like Toycar said, the maximum speed is whatever speed you have 100% control at all times. I also increase following distances by 3-5x on snow because in the lowest friction situations that is about how much braking distances can increase. It is ALWAYS better to have too much stopping distance vs not enough. You don't get to realize it isn't enough until it is too late, so plan accordingly.

As for the guy riding your ass, simply slow down and let him go around, or increase following distance even more to account for having to brake more slowly to prevent a rear-end collision.

2) Tires. I am pretty sure your tires are crap. I have even seen some all seasons with 1/2 the tread left see a significant reduction in cold weather traction compared to new. My original Michelin all seasons on the Si were worse than my max performance summer tires that I have on there now.

You need tires. The first indication that your problem is not FWD is the fact that the issue is primarily during breaking. AWD doesn't invent traction. It maximizes whatever traction you have during ACCELERATION. It has no effect on braking performance.

[Ralphie]

Ya so I need tires, that's for sure.

Yes the car has ABS. That's about it LMAO.

That's a good point about the AWD. That is pretty much what I read......it does shit for braking or driving, it's all about accelerating but you need traction to begin with.

[Ralphie]

Oh and I have all season tires. I can't afford to have winter wheels and tires, although maybe when Im making more money, Ill invest in a set.

Cant remember the make of 3 of them, but the front drivers is a Charger GT. Cheap shit but its brand new.

[RyanD]

Disregard speed limits when snow driving. Unplowed road, keep it 25 and under.
Sloshy kinda snow, even slower. It's the dry powdery stuff that's easiest to drive on.

New tires are your friend. Brake twice and slow as normal. If everyone else is going 10mph, go 10mph too.

5 spd pwns auto.

Steer through sliding rather than correct. Corrective steering spins the car around. Starts feeling slick, let off gas entirely and steer through it. No brakes allowed when sliding. Total no-no.

Trying to think what else. Driving in the shitty snow should be a sport. Super fun if you are good at it, scary as fuck if not.

I pwn the snow in my awd dsm. Hitting corners at 20mph sideways, spinning all 4 tires. Complete fucking blast

my auto does a really good job in the snow if i put it in 2nd

as for the pun part...FUCK YES! it is really fun if you know how to do it and drifting those corners is the best! i love when snow hits the ground. i dont even buy snow tires anymore. to me it ruins the fun

[AccordWarrior]

If you can't justify straight snow tires, the Continental ContiExtremeContacts are quite good in the white stuff.

Team O'Neil in NH does a winter driving class and their tire requirements used to be winter tires or those specific ones. I have a bunch of friends who ran them on their WRX/STis in the snow and were driving around everything on the road. The original compound was better than the new DWS models, but it's still a good tire for the money.

If you go the snow tire route, you want a narrower tire than OEM...as narrow as you can find keeping the overall tire height the same as OEM.

If I'm in an automatic car in the white stuff, I'm never in "D", I'm always in one of the lower gears.