How to make 30+hp for $500 or less... (DX/LX F22A1 only)

[PR CB7]

so technically
sometimes the valve train upgrade
aaint worth it,

cuz if u telling me that the springs are stiffer
then to make the cam work i cant use weak springs,
also if the cam is worn the if will fuck uup the bearing journals on the head,
making the cam not worth it

[deevergote]

The P12 may not provide the same gains with the A6 camshaft.



The A6 valvesprings are a different part number than the A1 and A4. Because the camshaft is a wilder profile, it only makes sense that they are stiffer springs.

The A6 also has a windage tray (not listed in the initial parts list)


The A4 header may not be a full 5hp over the A6 cast manifold, due to the similar design. The tubular design of the A4 manifold is technically superior to the cast A6 piece, but the potential gain is unknown.



As for a 150k mile cam... that's 150,000 miles of friction on that metal stick. They do wear.

[CB7Man]

Grab a P12 ECU and get a RPM Switch
Put the IAB's to the RPM Switch and let the P12 do the rest
Thats what I'm doing anyway
Well that and A6 cam, A4 Exh.

[PR CB7]

so if i where to create "in other words" an a6

a6 intake, cam, and ecu would do,

what about the rocker arm assembly, does it even change?

what bout the springs, are the a6 stiffer (dont assume plis)
i
f u get an 150k miles cam, and throw it an a 100k mile head,
wouldnt bearing clearences on the cam be affected?

header would be an a4
and YES PEOPLE the IAB's

would that be it ?

[owequitit]

just wondering if the f23 IM and TB would work like the h23 ones.

No. The F23 IM is not a direct bolt on for the F22Ax.

[ohdengitzpat]

just wondering if the f23 IM and TB would work like the h23 ones.

[lx-accord]

great info guys keep it up!!

[cb7addict]

I think im going to try this when I get my next cb . Ive never seen this tread before.

[owequitit]

In terms of quite a bit ... compared to a DC Sports header (which is steel)
and ceramic coated .. about as much .. or more?
I'm just trying to find out by how much more the underhood temps could be.

Would the a1 shield fit? (I dont believe it would) just looking at it, it looks like .. no, lol.

A Hui Hou !!!
Tomi

I never measured exactly, but it is definitely noticeable.

I would say about the same as a SS DC header, and more than a ceramic one.

[PakaloloHonda]

That is indeed an A6 upper half. You can leave the heatshield off, but it will raise your underhood temps by quite a bit.

In terms of quite a bit ... compared to a DC Sports header (which is steel)
and ceramic coated .. about as much .. or more?
I'm just trying to find out by how much more the underhood temps could be.

Would the a1 shield fit? (I dont believe it would) just looking at it, it looks like .. no, lol.

A Hui Hou !!!
Tomi

[owequitit]

Ok, then what I have here is from an A6?
Is that correct?
So this would be more beneficial then the stock a1 that I have?
And is it really, really necessary to re-istall the heat sheild? Because I dont have it.
Unless of course the a1 heat sheild fits back over the a6?
And I've read every post in these 12 pages .. very, very awesome info,
specialy the ecu stuff .. I have intake, (a6 header) and exhaust ..
Maybe look into a re-chipped ecu ..



A Hui Hou !!!
Tomi

That is indeed an A6 upper half. You can leave the heatshield off, but it will raise your underhood temps by quite a bit.

[PakaloloHonda]

Ok, then what I have here is from an A6?
Is that correct?
So this would be more beneficial then the stock a1 that I have?
And is it really, really necessary to re-istall the heat sheild? Because I dont have it.
Unless of course the a1 heat sheild fits back over the a6?
And I've read every post in these 12 pages .. very, very awesome info,
specialy the ecu stuff .. I have intake, (a6 header) and exhaust ..
Maybe look into a re-chipped ecu ..



A Hui Hou !!!
Tomi

[CB7Man]

If there is any flaws in the cast header, carbon seems to make things smooth

[owequitit]

HMMMMMm, u have no idea wat hp mt f20a sohc is. i think its like 130


The only think i can acutally use and it worth wild is the ecu
I dont think an a6 cam would do much but a 272 yes, wat u think bossman

The A6 cam makes a VERY noticable difference on an F22A1/A4.

[owequitit]

The tubular header will flow better because of the smoother design. A cast iron manifold will have a rough surface unless it's been extrude honed, which would be a monumental waste when you can pick up an A4 header for a few dollars at your local JY. At most, however, you're probably talking about 2-3hp difference. For comparison...

Cast iron 4-2-1 header from an F22A6:



Tubular steel 4-2-1 header from an F22A4:

I can guarantee you there is a lot more to the total flow of an exhaust system than just the internal surface of 1/2 of the manifold. The odds are likely that there isn't a total flow difference between the A4 manifold complete and the A6 manifold complete. You have the inner diameters, the shapes and the curves of the bends etc. You would need a flowbench at the very least to verify it, and CFD on the top end to figure out why the results are the way they are.

For instance. Since the A4 manifold is double walled with a space between both walls, that means the ID is quite a bit smaller than the OD that you see on the outside. The cool thing about cast vs tubular manifolds is that the cast metal is thicker and thus retains heat better, negating the need for the double wall construction on the A4, which was there solely to improve cat light off. I would be willing to bet that they could enlarge the inner diameter a fraction of an inch and offset the additional surface friction inside the primaries. Not to mention the fact that the steel used to make the A4 manifold in the first place was not the greatest for surface friction because it had to be cheap and mass produced.

If you look at your posted pics of the A4 vs the A6 manifold, you will also see how abrupt the collectors on the A4 manifold are vs the more gradual merges on the A6. That alone could potentially offset the difference. If you look at a high end collector such as Burns Stainless, you will notice that they will try to merge the exhaust gases over the longest possible distance, and will try to do so as smoothly as possible. Why? Because the more abruptly or severly we force gases to change direction and velocity, the more resistance to flow we get.

There are a lot of less than ideal variables in a stock manifold, and the A4 is no exception. Just because it has tubular construction, doesn't mean it is automatically better. There are about 1,000 different variables in play, and that is only accounts for a couple.

I bet if you flow tested them, they would be almost identical. If the A4 was better, I bet it would amount to less than 2 CRANK HP.