Bye bye ZO6...

[deevergote]

What the hell is that all about?

[91AccordLX]

weird thread. well is now.

[deevergote]

Yeah, you started it... why?

[accordaffair]

MAN that was a long read, I just now saw this thread cuz someone bumped it. I'm glad I'm not building on a lazy american motor, whew. I remember when I had a ford tempo, there was a guy who swapped in an SHO v6, still only did like 15.2. It's a commonly known fact that the majority of american motors are lazy, and don't have a good displacement-HP ratio. My tempo was a 2.3 I4 made 96 HP, my honda is 2.2 I4 makes 125. Yes thats because the ford I4 they put in there is lazy, and sluggish. I still think much more highly of japanese engines than American engines. If we just made something worth buying I could change my opinion, so why don't we?

[Gigante]

MAN that was a long read, I just now saw this thread cuz someone bumped it. I'm glad I'm not building on a lazy american motor, whew. I remember when I had a ford tempo, there was a guy who swapped in an SHO v6, still only did like 15.2. It's a commonly known fact that the majority of american motors are lazy, and don't have a good displacement-HP ratio. My tempo was a 2.3 I4 made 96 HP, my honda is 2.2 I4 makes 125. Yes thats because the ford I4 they put in there is lazy, and sluggish. I still think much more highly of japanese engines than American engines. If we just made something worth buying I could change my opinion, so why don't we?

You are using a tempo as the standard for american cars?!?!?! WTF. Even the guys on the boards that hate me have to agree that we are not talking about a freaking ford tempo engine. There is quite a big difference in a camaro or corvette compared to a tempo. I didnt say that every american car engine ever made was better than any import. Just stop talking.

[2point6]

Gigante, take your own advice... stop talking.

[accordaffair]

Gigante I didn't think you were still around. No the tempo is def. not a standard, but def. not an exception. American engines in general are lazy, they are built with high tolerences, and not as precise. Not that they're doomed, but they usually have lower displacement/HP ratio's. Why don't you unsuscribe from this thread if you don't want to hear arguements? And if you don't want us to talk to you anymore why don't you leave the forum? Have we brought anything helpful to the table for you? I remember when I was on the tempo/topaz owners forum. The members would rag the hardest on Honda's, preaching their inferiority. I, myself had never driven one, but being around peers that said such things, I believed them whole-heartedly. I thought that American engines were the best in the world, and lower displacement civics were garbage, slow as a scooter, and only idiotic F&F lovers drove them. My topaz fell apart, even though I cared for it like I was obsessive-compulsive. It seemed no matter what I did to try to save it, it was deteriorating under me. Finally I sold it, and was sad to see it go. I thought about buying another one. My parents were at a Honda dealership and I saw a cheap white sedan sitting in a corner. They asked if I wanted to take it for a test drive while my parents were on there's. It had just been traded in and the dealership hadn't had a chance to clean it up, but I drove it anyway. It was so great I decided I would buy a CB7. Not that one but one like it a year later. I know this story bears little relevance, but I'm simply saying that you're preaching to the converted here. I know plenty of fast 5.0 mustangs, they're as common as ricer civics. But I don't own a 5.0, I'll never buy a ford or any domestic until they get their stuff together and start producing quality machines. I don't know if you'll get any of us to agree with your opinion here, and unless you can prove 2.6 wrong, you won't get any of us to change our opinion of you. It's a losing situation that you have yet to salvage.

[deevergote]

American engines aren't known to be built to the tight tolerances of import engines (German and Japanese, anyway). Yes, American engines can make some major power. That has been proven. Even American I4s have been proven to be fast (Lisa Kubo's Saturn, for example... though GM has gotten smart and put Honda engines in their VUE, so who knows what they took from Honda for the Ion's engine! )

It's a neverending argument. Both platforms have pros and cons. So what. This particular board is dedicated to Japanese cars, with Japanese engines. This particular thread is an account of how a HIGHLY worked Japanese I4 beat an American V8... probably a stock one. Opinions are welcome. "Facts" are not, unless they can be backed up. If you think 2point6 is giving us a load of BS, fine. You can say it once. If 2point6 IS lying, fine. However, to make it an issue, please PROVE that it's a lie, or drop it!

Honda engines are quality. That is well known. American engines aren't known to be as high quality, but they are cheaper to repair... That's the argument most people give!

[Gen4Acclude]

i too have beat a z06 vette before so it not impossible alot has to do with the drive,

[Kaps11secC5]

Well, after much laughin about this on another board, I figured I would come to enlighten all of you. First off, I have a civic (intake/headers/exhaust) as my daily driver. I don't despise imports by any means.. I woulda also like to say that 12's in an na accord is impressive. But.....if you didnt guess by the name, I also have a vette.... You guys are really WAAAAAAAAAAY off the mark. I will try not to make personal attacks or anything of that nature, but here we go:

this guy in my apartment complex had a z06 with mods and made just under 480whp......he could only get a 12.9 out of it because he couldn't drive it that good, but i've seen him make 13.7 second passes and all in between......you gotta be able to put it to good use or it doesn't matter....

This is possible, if the person is completely unable to drive. Bone stock record in a 405 hp z06 is roughly 11.6/11.7 at @ 119. Of course, not every z06 is capable of the showroom floor, and a fewer people are capable of piloting one to those times. However, the average z06 can expect to run about 12.5 (given d/a is somewhat reasonable say, under 3500).

Damn dude that's horrible. If I remember correctly the Z06 runs a 12.9 stock with 405hp to the crank.

I have seen many magazine tests on a z06, and the slowest I have seen is Road and Track with a 12.8 (in the 350z/911/z06 comparo). However many magazines (to include arch rival Muscle Mustangs and Fast Fords) have piloted the z06 to 11 second 1/4 mile times. Once again, d/a, track prep, and driver ability all come into play, but if you are running anything over 12.8 you don't deserve to be behind the wheel of a car, esp at the track strip.

When you beat these vettes the other guy probably didnt even know you were racing.

That is probably the most accurate statement in this entire post...

The fact remains that stock Z06 on a their best day run 12.9, most run 13.5's and a regualr C5 runs 14.1-14.3 most run much higher because of there drivers. I KNOW I whip these things asses, and I'm sure 2.6 can do much worse.

Wow... So z's are 13 second cars now, and c5's are 14 second cars? You guys really need to unplug and step into reality. Seriously, instead of talking about cars online all the time, you guys need to get out to a race track once in awhile.

Bah, people like you are why Chevy is still producing the same 350 they did 30 years ago.

Actually, the LS1/LS6 is the third generation of small block chevy. It has a hydraullic roller motor (they weren't putting those in the '60's). A z06 revs up to 6500 rpm... The LS1 revs to 6k. The hp / per cubic inch of these motors is among the highest ever produced on na cars. These engines are a far cry from my parents SBC.

I do know a little about power to weight and i did the calulations just becasue you are so cocky.

Your Car(with you in it)-250hp-2570lbs.----Divide and get .0972
Z06(with a 190lb person)-405hp-3404lbs.--Divide and get .1189

Which means the Z06 has a better racing ratio. I even rounded your hp up in case you were having a really good day. So before you get real cocky go back to elementary school and learn how to correctly divide and shut up. Once again you want to talk to me when you dont know what your talking about.

Ok, here is one more post that makes sense.. You can also add the mechanical advantage of gearing from the 3.42 gears with the steep gear ratio of the MN12 6 speed in a z06. For gears 1-3 it would equate to about 4.30 gears in a standard 5 spd.

Wow... check out the big brain on brad... My power is made at the wheels, the figure you are using for the corvette is at the flywheel. Try again.

For once you have a vaild point... But go with this, 247.7 fwhp. 2570 / 247.7 = 10.3 lbs per hp.

02 + Z06 - 3150lbs, 365 rwhp (avg z06 rwhp) = 8.6 lbs per hp

Sry buddy nice try...

OF COURSE you can make a domestic sportscar faster with less money!....but will you be unique? hell no.

Well first off, a domestic sports car is a whole world faster to begin with... But if you want to push the envelope and make it faster, you better step up to the plate with a big wallet... They are significantly more expensive then modding an import (example, headers, high flow cats, and x-pipe for a Vette runs $1800 roughly, enough to buy a new engine for the accord). Unique? Take a drive around the block... Let me know how many modded Vettes you see, and how many accord, integras, and civics you see that are modded. Its not unique.

but chill a bit......most of the z06 owners out there will NEVER get the performance out of their car (or try) that really good drivers can.....thinking you can drive and actually doing it are two different things.....i've seen stock z06's pull high 13's with decent drivers and i'm sure a ton of people have trouble breaking into the 13's at all......you're comparing peak numbers and evaluating it all that way......most people will never see those types of numbers, not to mention the state of tune of the car isn't always 100%......if we all magazine raced, then it wouldn't be any fun.....actually doing it is the difference

Actually, a large % of z06 drivers take their cars to the track (not just drag racing, but many road race). As I said in my opening, several have seen 11 sec slips in stock z06's (down to paper filter, factory tires, etc..).

[MRX]

For once you have a vaild point... But go with this, 247.7 fwhp. 2570 / 247.7 = 10.3 lbs per hp.

02 + Z06 - 3150lbs, 365 rwhp (avg z06 rwhp) = 8.6 lbs per hp

Sry buddy nice try...

I personally think this thread should be closed but ummm...how does a stock rear wheel drive car only have a ~10% drivetrain loss? I'll say no more...somebody please close this thing too many haters in one place...they might form a committee

[cb7-R]

All those 11 second bone stock z06 C5's out there is impressive. Especially when the more powerful REGULAR C6 only runs mid 12's. I highly doubt the zo6's you are talking about are pulling 11 sec's bone stock.

[MRX]

wouldn't 11's make it faster than the vipers? and almost as fast as the mclaren and jag xj's(can never remember the numbers)...just asking

[ampstang]

Sorry if I insult anyone since I'm a newbie and everything, but it seems like none of you have a clue what you are talking about. Stock, most Z06s are running low 12s. There have also been a lot of guys running high 11s being stock down to the paper filter. Believe me, if you "raced" a Z06, he wasn't racing. I've had a lot of ricers come up to me when I'm driving my Mustang who rev their engines, then floor it. It's funny when they put on their emergency flashers like they just "owned" me. Guess what? I wasn't racing. You'll be lucky to find any Z06 owner that will race you at a stoplight. Most Z06 owners aren't 16 year old kids. If you want to learn more about Z06s, I recommend going to www.z06vette.com. If you want to learn more about true American power, go to www.svtperformance.com. I'm not trying to flame Accord owners, because I have one too, I'm just saying, before you starting saying this car is slow and that car is slow, learn a little about the cars first. Remember, the Z06 only weighs 3100lbs. and has around 365 rwhp stock. Motor Trend tested it and it ran a 12.2 quarter mile.

Not trying to specifically flame anyone, I just want to make sure you get your facts straight before you play the number game.

[04 TERMINATOR]

LOL.... As a matter of fact last night I made it back to the track here in Tucson. I ended up running against another Z06...LOL. I love those cars very much, but they are slow if the driver can't make good use out of it. On the track is different than the street of course, so keep that in mind as I tell you this... I ran a 13.40 @ 102 and the Z06 ran a 13.6. I was on slicks and the Z06 was on drag radials. The guy was amazed and totally cool to me after that in the staging lanes, unlike the younger guy I raced on the street. I did see the Z06 run a best of a 13.4 the next run. I also ran another 13.46 but it wasn't against him. As far as the guy raising the BS flag about my story, that is cool. He can have his opinion. I may even have a video of the passes last night if my friend was video taping me instead of the girls... We will see.

I know I am knew here but your story doesnt sound right, my car puts out 531 rwhp and even on bald drag radials it and not traction I can still turn 11's, and as far as your whp and wtq numbers dude it is hard to beleive.